GYMN-L Digest - 17 Apr 1996 to 18 Apr 1996 - Special issue

There are 22 messages totalling 608 lines in this issue.

Topics in this special issue:

1. American Cup Photos; Thanks to Grace
2. Strazeva and Omelianchik
3. Olympic Team Trial Tix (buy/trade/sell)
4. Worlds - W Roster RUS, USA, CAN (4)
5. Olympics tickets (2)
6. gymnasts, coaches and abuse
7. Dumb question re Worlds
8. <No subject given>
9. Trials Tickets
10. Worlds Web Page
11. US Women @ Worlds (2)
12. Vault at Wolrds: MAG
13. USAG Congress
14. RSG: Thais Intl.-Popova
15. needed oprah tape
16. Oprah from a Karolyi Parent
17. JO Spotting Rule Clarification - boys

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 06:12:08 -0600
From: ***@RMI.NET
Subject: American Cup Photos; Thanks to Grace

Hey friends,

Just a note to let you know that I (finally) have created a photo
gallery page for Debbie's fine American Cup Photos. You can reach it
via the Gymn home page, which is at
http://rainbow.rmii.com/~rachele/gymnhome.html.

Grace, thanks so much for sharing Worlds with us!

Rachele

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 08:47:09 EST
From: ***@MAIL.FIRN.EDU
Subject: Strazeva and Omelianchik

Last night I was watching my tape of the 88 games, and I was
reminded of a question that I had been wondering about for a long time.
When Strazeva was injured on beam, did Omelianchik start competing for the
Soviets the last 2 rotations. When they gave out medals, did both girls
receive medals? If anyone knows please let me know.
Gary

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 09:07:09 -0400
From: ***@CORNELL.EDU
Subject: Olympic Team Trial Tix (buy/trade/sell)

We want to obtain up to 5 tickets to the Olympic Team Trials Womens
Optionals in Boston. My daughter's gymnastics team purchased a block of 43
strip tickets covering all four days (mens and womens compulsories and
optionals), but several girls joined the team after we purchased the tickets
and would also like to attend. We would be willing to buy tickets or
possibly trade tickets to the mens compulsories and optionals for tickets to
the womens optionals. Our tickets are in the first and second rows of the
balcony in the $60 dollar section (that is, $15 for each of the four
nights). There also may be some of our families that will not go to Boston
on Thursday and may be willing to sell their tickets to the mens compulsory
events. Please contact me at: afr2@cornell.edu. Thanks.

Arnie

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 10:18:16 -0400
From: ***@GWIS2.CIRC.GWU.EDU
Subject: Re: Worlds - W Roster RUS, USA, CAN

Does anyone know why Dominique Dawes would only be competing in one event
when she has won medals on both bars and beam in the past?
Melissa


> Finally, Russia, USA, and Canada (amongst most countries) had to make their
> tough choices for Wednesdya's preliminary competition.
>
> Subdivision:
> I II III
> VT: Galieva Khorkina
> Powell Chow
> MacEachern Tousek
> UB: Kotchetkova Khorkina
> Phelps
> Cousineau Tousek
> BB: Galieva Khorkina
> Phelps
> Exaltacion Tousek
> FX: Kotchetkova Kotchetkova
> Powell Dawes
> MacEachern Tousek
>
> Grace
>

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 10:15:23 -0600
From: ***@ZEPHYR.MEDCHEM.PURDUE.EDU
Subject: Re: Worlds - W Roster RUS, USA, CAN

What surprises me is that Kotchekova ISN'T in BEAM and Galieva
is competing. Dina's got that phenomenal Full twisting FF-ff-layout
series that she now does and was a finalist on BB in Sabae, finishing
just out of the medals.

And if Khorkina is so injured, I wonder why she
's competing all events?

Jeff

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 11:33:16 -0400
From: "***@PHOENIX.PRINCETON.EDU
Subject: Re: Worlds - W Roster RUS, USA, CAN

Does this mean that the US will enter *only* one athlete on beam and
bars? Or, have they just not decided to put in the second slot for each
of the events. I agree, it would be surprising if Dominique Dawes was
only entered on one event.

-emily

> Finally, Russia, USA, and Canada (amongst most countries) had to make their
> tough choices for Wednesdya's preliminary competition.
>
> Subdivision:
> I II III
> VT: Galieva Khorkina
> Powell Chow
> MacEachern Tousek
> UB: Kotchetkova Khorkina
> Phelps
> Cousineau Tousek
> BB: Galieva Khorkina
> Phelps
> Exaltacion Tousek
> FX: Kotchetkova Kotchetkova
> Powell Dawes
> MacEachern Tousek
>
> Grace
>

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 12:50:15 -0400
From: ***@YORKU.CA
Subject: Re: Worlds - W Roster RUS, USA, CAN

I e-mailed Grace privately about the US team situation. Dawes is
competing UB BB and FX in subdivision 2, but for some reason this info
didn't make the post, although she meant to include it.
Chris.

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 14:49:59 -0400
From: ***@GATEWAY.US.SIDWELL.EDU
Subject: Olympics tickets

Anyone who still wants Olympics tickets (or didn't get any thanks to the
unFairTix system :) should go visit http://www.atlanta.olympic.org using a
Web browser (Lynx, Netscape, Mosaic, whatever). This is the official site
for the Atlanta Olympics and (among other useful things) they have a place
where you can order tickets that were on hold or something until recently.
Last I checked they still had tickets to some *very* desirable events,
including the men's AA final and the team final (optionals) for both men
and women! And it actually works -- the database with tickets that are
still available is updated fairly regularly (when I ordered my tickets it
had just been updated about 2 hours before), and a confirmation email is
sent usually within 1 business day. If you have a secure browser (such as
Netscape) you can order using a secure order form; if your browser isn't
secure or if you're squeamish about sending out credit card info over the
Internet, there's a (toll) number you can call to order the tickets. I
just added a few tickets for women's compulsories to my order and I
recently got my confirmation email. I'm really excited -- this is much
better than anything I got through FairTix!

One note of warning for people who want *cheap* seats: the vast majority
of the seats are "A-level" (the best) and these can be very expensive
(e.g. $212 for AA finals, $265 for the gymnastics exhibition). But the
prices come down considerably if you go see the earlier qualifying
rounds. Also, if you're going to be in town at the beginning of the
two weeks, you might want to order tickets to podium training. The most
expensive podium training tickets are $22, I think, and you get to see
the gymnasts in a semi-competition-like setting (no scores or judges
or anything, but they're on the actual apparatus). One other warning: if
it says only so many seats together are available, don't order more than
that number. If you need more than that number, put in two separate
orders. Otherwise you run a really high risk of not getting any tickets
at all!

Hope this helps someone out!
Lisa

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 12:12:38 -0700
From: ***@NETCOM.COM
Subject: Re: Olympics tickets

> Anyone who still wants Olympics tickets (or didn't get any thanks to the
> unFairTix system :) should go visit http://www.atlanta.olympic.org using a

Not to burst anyone's bubble, but here's what the April 22nd issue of
_Time_ magazine says about this (p.28):

"The Atlanta Games' Internet site for ticket sales has turned decidedly
low-tech. Officials had said e-mail orders would be confirmed within 24
hours. Since the Website is not connected to a mainframe computer,
however, many orders are being processed by overburdened phone
operators. As a result, confirmation often takes two weeks or more.
Things have been further confused because some worried customers have
repeated their orders."

Good luck to anyone and everyone still looking for Olympics tickets!

Debbie :-)

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 16:17:18 -0400
From: ***@NORFOLK.INFI.NET
Subject: gymnasts, coaches and abuse

There are in gymnastics, like in any other establishment or institution,
glories and abuses.

My daughter is a 10-year old level 9/10 who trains at the same gym as Alexis
Brion (the third ranked junior in the country). Often she trains in the
same group. Gymstrada has at least four elites (three of whom are
international elites) and a rather large crop of upcoming 9's and 10's.

Yes, our girls work in excess of 35 hours per week. I have occassionally
not agreed whole-heartedly with how the girls are spoken to. I am at the
gym constantly and know pretty well what goes on. I have never witnessed
abuse of any kind.

As to the Oprah show I have only this to say--what is the rate of teenage
pregnancies, high school drop outs (self studying doesn't count), teenage
drinking, smoking and delinquency among elite gymnasts? Much, much lower
than the norm I imagine. Do we know where our children are? Yes we
do--they're not at the mall with the wrong crowd, they're not out running
the streets smoking and drinking or being promiscuos (sp), they're in the
gym building character to last a lifetime. Nearly all of the gymnasts at my
daughter's gym are honor roll students. A large number of those are
straight A students or students in advanced honors classes. I was surprised
to realize just how many gymnasts are exceptional students. Their ability
to concentrate and focus helps outside the gym.

At ten years old, my daughter is a straight A to nearly straight A student
who--knows how to make a collect call, can budget money (for when she goes
out of state for meets) has been to several different states where she has
made friends.

Beleive me, if I wanted to subject my daughter to abuse, I could do it for a
LOT less money than by sending her to the gym each month (just a joke).
Connie

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 17:12:26 -0400
From: ***@HICOM.NET
Subject: Dumb question re Worlds

Howdy, GYMNers!

Re: Grace's much-appreciated (!) updates:

>>Finally, Russia, USA, and Canada (amongst most countries) had to make their
>>tough choices for Wednesdya's preliminary competition.

>>Subdivision:
>> I II III
>>VT: Galieva Khorkina
>> Powell Chow
>> MacEachern Tousek
>>UB: Kotchetkova Khorkina
>> Phelps
>> Cousineau Tousek
>>BB: Galieva Khorkina
>> Phelps
>> Exaltacion Tousek
>>FX: Kotchetkova Kotchetkova
>> Powell Dawes
>> MacEachern Tousek


I have what may be a dumb question about these Event Worlds going on in PUR
right now. If a country sends three gymnasts, are that country's three gymnasts
each allowed to compete all four events? I mean, is the subdivision in what's
above IT? Was each country limited to only one or two gymnasts per event? I
see Phelps, Exaltacion, Galieva & Powell on two events. I see Khorkina &
Kochetkova on three events. I see Tousek on four events. I see spots before my
eyes...

And, whoa! I see four US names (Chow, Phelps, Dawes, Powell). I thought we
were only sending three!?!

Set me straight, folks...! This Event Worlds thing has got me a little
confused...


Merci,
Michele

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 19:38:13 -0400
From: ***@PIPELINE.COM
Subject: <No subject given>

Cc:
Subject: Re: Strazeva and Omelianchik

> Last night I was watching my tape of the 88 games, and I was
>reminded of a question that I had been wondering about for a long time.
>When Strazeva was injured on beam, did Omelianchik start competing for the

>Soviets the last 2 rotations. When they gave out medals, did both girls
>receive medals? If anyone knows please let me know.
>
No, once the competition began the alternate could not enter. The GDR ran
into this problem when Martina Jentsch was injured before optionals and
they had only 5 girls on the floor. I didn't see the medal ceremony, but I
would assume Omeliantchik did not receive a medal.
:-(
Mara

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 21:30:53 -0400
From: ***@AOL.COM
Subject: Trials Tickets

Hi, I am looking for women's Olympic Trials tickets, any session. Does
anyone have any they are willing to sell? If not, do you know how I can get
them without ordering the whole package.
Thanks!
-KFGym

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 23:50:02 -0400
From: ***@GINGER.CAPITALNET.COM
Subject: Worlds Web Page

Apologies to all for that mess of a post last night.
I will forgo the mail now that I can just upload to the web.
Go see http://www.capitalnet.com/~chiug/cangym.html.

For those of you without web access, either e-mail me.

Regards,

Grace

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 23:10:06 -0500
From: ***@EXPERT.CC.PURDUE.EDU
Subject: US Women @ Worlds

Could someone please let me know which events each of the US women
competed on? Did Dominique Dawes only do bars and beam? I was surprised
to see Dominique so far back in the standings...Do their scores carry
over? Thanks in advance!

--Aaron

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Date: Tue, 16 Apr 1996 03:19:37 PDT
From: ***@AMDAHL.CO.ZA
Subject: Vault at Wolrds: MAG

Does anyone know if the South African vaulter at Wolrds got the vault he did
named after him. I heard somrthing about it on the sports news, but I don't
know for sure. Does anyone know any other South African results?
Thanks anyway, Helen.

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 18:43:08 +0000
From: ***@ALOHA.NET
Subject: USAG Congress

For those of you who have plans to attend the USAG Congress during
the US Olympic Trials in Boston-better get a move on. Of the three
host hotels-Boston Marriott and Westin are both sold out. I did not
check the Copley Plaza because at $149 a night that is a little out
of my league. They are also probably sold out.

As for air fare, well when I called Delta-the official airline of the
Congress-supposedly offering special discount fares to attendees-they
quoted me a whopping rate of $982.00 rountrip from Honolulu to
Boston!!! Way way out of my league. I checked with local travel
agencies here in Honolulu and was able to find a fare for half of
what I was quoted by Delta. So I would really recommend that
attendees exercise great caution and shop around for air fares.

Anyone know what the weather will be like in Boston in June?

Aloha!

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 18:21:46 +0000
From: ***@ALOHA.NET
Subject: RSG: Thais Intl.-Popova

The Popova you are referring to from Ukraine may actually be Tatiana
Popova. She made her debut during the 93 Bucharest Junior RSG
Europeans. She is coached by Irina Deryugina.

Your report showcases the continuing domination of the former Soviet
republics in the sport of RSG. Valeria Vatkina and Olga Perepelitsa
of Belarus are both junior gymnasts of excellent calibre. No offense
to our French GYMNERs but Serrano may have only won some events
because she clearly had more experience in the senior international
circuit.

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 21:57:03 -0700
From: ***@WSUNIX.WSU.EDU
Subject: needed oprah tape

hey fellow gymnastics lovers! I've finally had the chance to check up on
all that has been said here about the oprah winfrey show. Unfortunately,
i missed it due to class and an unaccessable vcr...anyway, i was
wondering if anyone has a copy that i could see. i live in Pullman,
Washington so if anyone lives in or near washington that would be great.
I have a feeling that i am not going to care for it too much. Although,
i quit gymnastics after 9 years of competitive hell. granted, it was fun
and my choice but i quit because of some what abusive coaches. i was a
level 9 at age 11 and it was so stressful. all they cared about was
winning and i think thats sad. they threatened to kick us off the team
if we couldn't throw a double back layout. one night, i landed on my
neck and was scared to tumble backwards. so, they kicked me off the
team... i switched to another gym but i never got back the talent i
had. who knows, i could have been in the olympics. anyway, enough on
that. i would love a copy. email me privately at :
***@wsunix.wsu.edu Thank you.

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Date: Wed, 17 Apr 1996 22:20:51 -0700
From: ***@IX.NETCOM.COM
Subject: Oprah from a Karolyi Parent

I taped the Oprah show while my daughter and I were at Karolyi's. I am
seriously disappointed in the show and in Oprah herself. Only a fool
would believe there is purely bad in gymnastics! Which is the sole side
Oprah choose to present to the world.
My family can speak for the good side of the sport. My daughter
asked at age 3 for gymnastic lessons for her 4th birthday. It was
watching all those news interest stories on Kim Zmeskle and then seeing
her at the Olympics that peaked my child's interest. At age 3, my
child chose to enter gymnastics and she said she wanted to go to the
Olympics. We granted our daughter's birthday request and have never
regretted her choice or our decision!
Her first year and a half were spent at S.E.G.A. in Houston, TX.
She had a wonderful experience there. The coaches ( Barbie, Tammy,
Star, and George to name a few) were very supportive and encouraging.
So much so, that when her talent became apparent and at that time there
was not any room on a pre-team, we were encouraged to take our daughter
to Karolyi's by several of the coaches.
At 5 1/2 , our daughter was enrolled in classes at Karolyi's. She
was on the Developmental I team within days of her 6th birthday, and
competed for the first time four months later. Her experiences at
Karolyi's have been very positive for the most part. We did have a
problem with one coach who believed that our child was his personal
scapegoat. And to that, we discussed our problem with Marta Karolyi,
who was understanding and concerned about the welfare of our child.
Marta handled the situation with great care and the situation was soon
resolved. In the end, our child was moved to the "Hopes" team, were she
has excelled and is looking to a promising competition season this
fall.
Having been at Karolyi's for two years (which is more than Joan
Ryan can say) I can say only good of Marta and Bela Karolyi and their
techniques. Marta often watches the younger girls as she goes through
the gyms. She gives them encouragement and lets the girls know she
cares with an approving nod of her head. All the girls try extra hard
when they see Marta in the gym. It's not from fear or intimidation,
they are so proud to be able to show Marta their skills and know she is
watching them. As for Bela, oh how the little girls love Bela! When the
little girls see him, they run to hug him and play this cute little
muscle game with him. He will stop and talk to them by name. Bela also
gives the girls those wonderful smiles and nods of encouragement, even
at his busiest times.
We are lucky to have the privilege to be able to watch Dominique,
Svetlana, Kerry, Kim and the elite's train with Arthur, Marta and Bela.
We've never seen or heard any negative comments spoken to those girls
in the back gym. The girls look healthy and can often be seen laughing
and smiling along with their coaches. Don't get me wrong, it's not all
fun and games to train so hard, but they would not be here if they did
not enjoy it and want to be here. This can be said for the littlest
gymnast here to the highest gymnast here!
There will always be injury and illness in any sport.... How many
football players have been seriously injured in their pursuit of the
game? How many jockeys (and models for that fact) starve themselves to
stay a certain weight? I could go on and on with this game..... Get
the point?
As for the size of these gymnasts..... Football players and
weight lifters are big people! Sumo wrestlers are fat people!
Basketball players are tall people! Jockeys are short people! Face the
fact that certain sizes make for better athletes in certain sports!
As for Oprah, she should have given Betty a chance to talk! Betty
saw no point in setting herself up to have everyone second guess her
every word, just as Oprah was doing! Oprah ought to read Bela's book,
Kim and Mary Lou's books and more than just the one book on 101 ways to
trash gymnastics, ice skating and the Karolyi's!
Going back to if children can make choices. Our daughter has
chosen to stay in gymnastics and to this day she still says she wants
to go to the Olympics in 2004. She is well aware that not everyone gets
to the Olympics, and knows there is nothing wrong with setting a high
goal. We believe in her and will support her in every way we can!

Karen.

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Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 01:27:14 +0000
From: ***@DORSAI.ORG
Subject: JO Spotting Rule Clarification - boys

A copy of the recently distributed JO spotting Clarification from
USAG has been posted to the NGJA's web site.

It can be accessed at http://www.ngja.org

Attention judges: If you wish to be listed in our email directory,
please send me a note.

Ken

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Date: Thu, 18 Apr 1996 01:34:20 -0400
From: "***@GINGER.CAPITALNET.COM
Subject: Re: US Women @ Worlds

Dominique also competed on floor, but messed up her back 2.5-punch front,
and went out of bounds and ended up with 9.30. Otherwise, it was a good
routine. On bars, Jaycie went up in the 1st rotation of the first subdivision.
Dominique went in the 2nd rotation of the second subdivision.
There were a lot of high scores on bars all night with lots of ties.
Five girls are tied for fifth at 9.750. Bars had the highest qualifying scores
for semi-finals. Only 16th place Alena Polozkova from Belarus didn't start from
a 10 (she started with 9.90).

On beam, Jaycie went in the first subdivision and Dominique went in the
second subdivision. Both had solid routines, and in fact, both got the
same scores from the same judges except the Finnish judge gave Jaycie a 9.80 and
Dominique a 9.75.

USA and Romania didn't get drawn to compete in the 3rd subdivision.

So what am I talking about with "subdivisions"? Well, each country may allot up
to 2 gymnasts per even and only 1 gymnast per country is drawn for each
subdivision. By nnumbers of countries and numbers of events, the men needed 2
subdivisions while the women needed three.

Amy Chow hit two good Yurchenko double twists for 7th. I think she should be be
ahead of Simona Amanar who threw the same vaults but messier.

Kristy Powell hit a clean floor routine and is tied for fourth with Gui Yuanyu
I think should be in first), nevertheless for Kristy this is good since she
competed in the first subdivision. Kristy sat down on her second vault so
she ended up in 20th.


Regards,
Grace

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End of GYMN-L Digest - 17 Apr 1996 to 18 Apr 1996 - Special issue
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