GYMN-L Digest - 13 Oct 1995 to 14 Oct 1995 - Special
issue
There are 9 messages totalling 610
lines in this issue.
Topics in this special issue:
1. Worlds Report #2
2. workout times
3. Tatiana Gutsu
4. 10-13 responses
5. jurrassic
park gymnast
6. story from Russian team comps
7. purchasing a
tramp
8. Gymnastic
Magazines
9. ADMIN: Gymn Survey Results
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Date: Fri, 13 Oct 1995 22:59:47
-0400
From: ***@FREENET.SCRI.FSU.EDU
Subject:
Worlds Report #2
China,Japan,Romania,Germany,Ukraine,Usa
This
report will be less detailed than the previous one
because
I could only identify the US gymnasts and a handfull
of the others.
------------------------------------------------------------
*China*
*Pommels*
-no one swings higher above the horse or is more
extended
than the Chinese.Beautiful
work.
*Vault*
-the actual vaults
were difficult but their landings
sucked(with the
exception of Li Xiashuang.)
*PB*
-double backs(one was piked) and
double fronts in between
the bars was compulsory
for everyone
*High Bar*
-swung the
hell out of pipe
*Floor*
-once again
had trouble with landings
-Xiaoshuang threw a
double twisting double layout.
*Notes*
-definitely
the deserving winners
-just like the Chinese women
they had terrific form and
technique
*Japan*
*Notes*
-only saw a few of their routines,but
noticed they were
getting overscored
out the wazoo.
*Romania*
*PB*
-gymnast did a press to english
handstand on one bar to a
healy
twirl(handstand on one bar to healy)
*High
Bar*
-Wowsers.This team threw just about
every release in just
about every concievable combination.Best high
bar team
there.
-neat
combo by gymnast-tkachev,tkachev,tkachev,thomas hop to
one arm reverse hect
*Rings*
-Burinca-strength,strength,and more
strength
I was really impressed by this team.They should have been
ahead
of Japan.They probably would have if they had
the
services of veteran Marius Gherman.
*Ukraine*
*High
Bar*
-Sharipov-piked gaylord,highest tkachevs on
the
planet,closed with a
triple back
*Floor*
-Sharipov-fell
back on double full punch front dismount
-Korobchinsky-ruptured
his achilles on the take off
for his
closing double layout.It
was a nasty looking crash and he
injured his other
foot on the landing.He lay motionless for
a few seconds,checked out his foot,then was carried off to
the
hospital.
*Pommel Horse*
-With Korby
out,they had to use their
replacement(who said
that he HATES pommel horse)He
was a little shakey,but he
stayed
on.
*Vault*
-Misutin-1 1\2 handspring front(stuck)j
-Sharipov-low tucked omelianchik
vault
*Notes*
Misutin couldn't do
AA because he skipped a few events.He
wasn't injured coming into the meet,but
during compulsory
vault warmups
he had a freak accident and injured his
foot.They've also lost Korby,so
that will hurt them in
Atlanta next year.
*Germany*
*High
Bar*
-Wecker-two lightning fast kovacs,tkachev,and laid out
full
out(no more triple back)
*Floor
Ex*
-unidentified-layout full in,three bounder front layouts,and
double layout dismount
-belenky-double layout(small hop),front layout front
layout
front full,double
full punch front dismount
*Pommel Horse*
-wecker-fell off on a back moore
*rings*
-Belenky-straight body planche pressout,two
malteses,and a
layout
full in.Strength moves were great.
*Vault*
-definitely their weakest event.Falls
and easy(well for this
round anyway)vaults cost
them precious points.
*United States*
*Rings*
-Kip
Simons-strength moves were performed well
*Vault*
-Simons-threw
a double twisting layout tsuk
-Lynch-put his
hands down on a layout cuervo
*PBars*
-Stein-fell through the bars after a stutz to one bar
-Lynch-swung
probably the nicest p-bar set of the
competition.Two
giant diamidovs and STUCK his double front
dismount.His routine was
underscored compared to the other
ones I saw.
*High
Bar*
-Baigu-peeled off after a kovacs,but showed gorgeous
form
and line.one arm geinger
and tripple dismount.
*FX*
-double back punch front 1 1\4 from Kip Simons and Josh
Stein
-Jair did a unique second pass of front full,layout
front,front
full
-roethlisberger-double
double mount,OPEN full in dismount
*Pommels*
-Blaine
fell off pommels
-Baigu swung his way to
finals
*Notes*
The US was the biggest suprise
in compulsories by placing
3rd!!!!The HIT!Only one miss(Jair on pommels) out of 36
routines.That's probably the best competition that
the US
has EVER had.
Unfortunately,by the time optionals
rolled around it was
quite obvious that they were
out of their league compared to
the other 5 teams
in the last session(along with Russia and
Belarus)In
terms of difficulty,execution,form and consitency
they lagged
behind.
John MacReady shows TREMENDOUS promise.He has every thing
else and will really shine when he throws in some more
difficulty.Jair had some unique
and difficult skills,but was
a
little weak on rings and vault.Baigu's body line and
toe
point were tops,but
he fell all over the place.Almost blew
vault again when he only got one hand on the preflight of
his yurchenko.Pommel horse was his
best event.Blain and Kip
are
animals on the strength events,but aren't very
graceful.Blain couldn't point his
toes to save his life.Kip
had
an injury(back?) but it didn't seem to hinder his
performance.Nothing flashy about these two,although they
look a
little "clunky" due to their size.John
Roethlisberger
was the highest US finisher after
the team
portion(8th.Yeah,I know it could happen)
thanks to the
screwy judging during compulsories.I must say that I'm not a
big fan of his gymnastics.Cheap
and cheesey skills.World
class on floor(He should have made floor finals.But
RINGS!?!?!?)but his other events are
pretty blah.He was
consistent
though,and that's why he did so well.Overall
everyone did well(*EXCEPTIONALLY* well in compusories.)It
was also
refreshing to have the UCLA All Star whining squad
absent
from this meet. :-)
Until next time,
Billy
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 01:34:54
-0400
From: ***@AOL.COM
Subject:
workout times
Our club is doing a survey of workout hours and prices
for different levels
of competitive gymnastics- if
you could provide hours and/or prices- it would
be
much appreciated!
Thanks,
Leesa
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 02:31:38
-0500
From: ***@EXPERT.CC.PURDUE.EDU
Subject:
Re: Tatiana Gutsu
>From what I last saw
on news in the very beginning of 1995, she is training
in
my state....INDIANA. The news
coverage interviewed her and her American
coach. They train in Greenwood, IN I
believe. Of course she says she
is
hoping for the 96 Olympics. That was what she said a long time
ago. I am
not
sure what she is up to, but in the interview she appeared very grown-up,
physically that is.
I didn't recognize her.
Sincerely, Aaron
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 03:08:40
-0500
From: ***@EXPERT.CC.PURDUE.EDU
Subject:
10-13 responses
FRONT TUMBLING: I can see how it sometimes looks
"watered-down". I
particularlylike
passes that combine front and back tumbling. I think it is
most
impressive to have a forward twisting element with more than
just a full twist.
i.e. 1.5 or 2.
MO
HUILAN: I prefer Mo's tumbling passes from last year's World Team Champ.
I
feel ti fits her "look" and personality
better. I do feel she appears
stronger this year, but the routine (I am refering to floor) doesn't seem
to
be carried off as well as the 1994 one.
I really enjoy her and I have
very high
expectations of her in the future.
SHANNON MILLER: Bravo to Miss
Shannon! I was very proud of
her. I thought
she was very strong and brave. Competing with an injury to help her
team
is true class. I feel sorry for her not getting any individual
medals, but
at least we know she is a true gymnast
pride and true!
DAWES, CHOW, BORDEN: Just imagine if they weren't
injured....hmmm Silver maybe,
hmmm
possibley Gold??????????
HIGH SCHOOL
GYMNASTICS: Anyone interested in Indiana High School Girls'
Gymnastics? I would be glad to update those
interested. Indiana has a very
deep field of talented gymnasts. The current state champs have a girl
who
use to be a national competitor. She is the current AA, beam, and floor
champ.
She is a great gymnast, as well are many others. The high school season starts
the first of Jan.
Practices start the first of Nov.
Let me know, it would
be my pleasure!
That
should be it for now. I am looking
forward to the AA competition on Sun.
Gymnastically Yours,
Aaron
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 11:08:00
+0000
From: ***@BROOKES.AC.UK
Subject:
jurrassic park gymnast
I am curious to know
who the gymnast
who did some of the stunts in jurrassic
park is.I read in a magazine when
the film first came out that it was an
olympic gymnast but have never found out who.Any ideas?
thanks,Anouska
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 08:58:25
-0400
From: ***@MAGNUS.ACS.OHIO-STATE.EDU
Subject:
story from Russian team comps
Here's a rather
amusing story Abie Grossfeld
told me about. During team
compulsories, when
Russia was self-destructing, Abie was sitting with Yury
Titov's wife. She kept making comments like "oh, this is just
terrible," "what
a catastrophe,"
"I can't believe this is happening," "what a nightmare" and
so
on, to which Abie
kept agreeing. This went on for a while, and then Mrs. Titov
remarked "this is just going to ruin the legal system
all over the world." Abie
gave
her a very perplexed look, wondering what on earth the Russian men's poor
performance could have to do with the international legal
system, and Mrs.
Titov said
"I just can't believe they acquitted OJ!" So much for her
concern
about the Russian team! :)
Beth
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 09:30:05
-0600
From: ***@RMII.COM
Subject:
purchasing a tramp
I know we have a couple equipment suppliers on the
list, so I thought
I would forward this request. Please reply to him directly at
mattk@scripps.edu (Matt).
| Could you get me some
information or send me in the right direction for
| information
on purchasing a trampoline? I am
looking for a rectangular
| 7 by 14 foot size. If nothing else you may know where I
could look.
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 17:59:39
GMT
From: ***@IX.NETCOM.COM
Subject:
Gymnastic Magazines
Does anyone know of other gymnastic magazines
about US gymnastics
besides IG and USA
Gymnastics? I really enjoy
these
publications, andd
would like to read more!
------------------------------
Date: Sat, 14 Oct 1995 11:03:48
-0600
From: ***@RMII.COM
Subject:
ADMIN: Gymn Survey Results
----------------------Gymn Survey-----------------------------------
73
responses (out of 530 members at the time of the survey)
The Gymn Survey, for those who were not on board at the time,
was
meant to determine if the forum wanted to move
to a topical type of
mail distribution. You would be able to subscribe only to
the topics
that you wanted. Possible suggested topics were:
rhythmic, coaching,
collegiate gymnastics,
etc. The downside was the
potential
fragmentation of Gymn,
and also the expected increase in
administrative
mail.
The overwhelming answer to the survey is that while the majority
of
the forum feels that forum traffic is
excessive, Gymn does NOT want to
move to a topical subscription format as presented in the
survey
announcement. Many cited the increase in
administration as the reason
for their vote. (Perhaps this point is best illustrated
by the fact
that two of the respondents did not
follow the directions the email
their replies to
gymnjunk@aol.com.) Thanks to all Gymners who
participated!
However,
a viable alternative solution was proposed by many of the
Gymners who
answered the survey. Informally, we would like to
introduce
a topic system to Gymn. When posting to Gymn, please begin
your
subject with a keyword that describes a topic categorizing your
message. This
enables all Gymners to more quickly determine the
mail
that interests them and the mail that
doesn't. Also, those Gymners
with advanced mail
readers can filter out messages for topics that
don't
interest them.
If our more frequent posters follow this method, and
set the example,
then this alternative solution
could be quite useful.
Sample keywords for topics:
RSG, WOMEN,
MEN, COACHES, COL-W (collegiate women), COL-M, RESULTS,
FAN, KIDS
Keywords
are not restricted to those I listed above; in fact it would
be a good idea to develop keywords for threaded discussions
(eg,
"WORLDS", "MEDIA" or
"THE BOOK" would be examples of possible keywords
for recent discussions). Use more than one keyword if you think
it's
appropriate.
I myself will try to
start labeling these types of Gymn msgs as
"ADMIN". When you see ADMIN, please don't say "oh this will be
boring"
and then delete it without reading it.
;)
Below are a few of the (anonymous) responses to the
survey. I think
these sentiments say more than our Gymn
Guidelines ever could. Enjoy!
Rachele
=======================================================================
...As
you point out, the collegiate scene is not one I follow, so I
usually delete those posts... It would save me time and money if
I
could ignore such posts.
----------
Yes,
I would be in favour of selecting preferred topics. I
am
basically only interested in facts and first
hand meet descriptions at
a national &
international level. I enjoy (obviously, since I
subscribe)
the gymn list but would consider a topic option
an
improvement.
----------
I
really am getting frustrated with Gymn lately (and I
know I'm not
the only one.) Two people I know here
have unsubscribed because of the
fluff content,
and one has asked to me to forward to him only the
messages
with some content to them.
----------
I don't think the bulk
of the users have the sophistication to use the
topic
system.
----------
I have a suggestion for an intermediate
way of grouping messages which
I've seen used successfully on newsgroups
with high volume. The idea
is to use the first part of the subject line to classify
posts, just
as it appears you do when using the sublists. We
could make up a list
of suggested abbreviations
and post them to the list once and include
them in
the gymn guide.
...If a topic suddenly
becomes of interest (ie. "THE BOOK"), a
poster
could just make up a category, put it at
the beginning of his/her
message and put a line at
the beginning saying "please use a category
of
"BOOK" for future messages on this topic".
----------
I
seem to be able to wade through all the posts. To me, the sublists
seem more trouble than they are worth. Just MHO.
----------
For
myself, being in a club situation, I welcome the discussion on
other disciplines, such as rythmic
and sports acro., and would miss
these if a sublists are formed.
With the current size of the forum I
can see no
advantage. Obviously if there is an explosion in the
numbers
then we may have to think again.
----------
I Think the idea of topic subscriptions is great. I would like to see
topic areas set aside for business only, coaching only, fan
only,
college only.
----------
Don't
fragment the list. It drives us
crazy to have to post to
different sublists or miss a topic, etc. There are several of us here
who read the gymnlist. It's fine the way it is.
----------
Yep,
I'm all for topics so I can avoid the heaps of mail I'm not
interested in.
----------
I'm on another
mailing list that used to have a very high volume and
has
gone to a distribution type of system to allow people to only get
messages on topics that they are interested in. This list has just
about died because people have stopped posting since they
don't have
the time to figure out how to use it
and this is a list of people
involved in computer
science, not just your average person with a PC
and
access to the internet through a commercial service.
----------
Sure,
Gymn may have gone over the 500
subscriber mark, but how many
have we
lost?
Here is a perfect example of the kind of thing I'm referring
to:
<example deleted>
I
**really** don't think it's necessary for 500 people to see this, do
you?
They're not exactly doing anything
"wrong" besides wasting bandwidth,
not
to mention annoying a large percentage of subscribers, so I can
imagine it's tough to take any type of "action"
against someone in
particular.
----------
I
think that sublists is a great idea.
Despite the confusion or the
extra added
mental efforts to make sublists an active part of
the
system, I think it is a necessity. It can only enhance our existing
Gymn digest by allowing us to post questions to areas of
real
interest. But what I'd really love to do is filter
out all the mail
I'm not interested in reading.
----------
Yes!
Yes! Yes! It half an hour a night
to read through my mail for
fear of missing
anything. Some things (like general
gossip, rhythmic,
Mens) I enjoy watching (except
the gossip), but don't know enough to
discuss nor
have the time. This would greatly
simplify my life!
----------
Look at how many people can't
figure out how to unsubscribe. I
really
wouldn't want all of the admin requests to Gymn... "How do I get this
topic
and unsubscribe from that topic?"
It would be more work for you
and Debbie
too. I think that topics would
INCREASE Gymn fluff mail,
not
DECREASE it.
----------
When I first subscribed, Gymn was a high quality forum. I still love
Gymn,
but it has gone downhill because of the number of useless posts,
IMHO. A lot of times, the people who are
posting seem like nice
people and so I don't want
to write them and say "That wasn't worth
mailing
to 500 people," but at the same time I am getting frustrated!
----------
I
don't think we should diversify into subtopics at this time. I
don't
think there will really be people who like this aspect and don't
like that aspect and so on.
----------
I
wouldn't want to miss info posted in a section I was not subscribed
to.
----------
I think the sublist is great.
There are many days that I bring up my
e-mail
only to be overwhelmed with mail from gym, much of which is of
no interest to me and much of which is worthless, I suspect,
to most
of us. ...
I like a lot about gym, but I must admit that there are
times that I come close to unsubscribing because there is
just too
much mail.
----------
This
response isn't really about topics, but about Gymn
mail in
general (since you asked for suggestions
in general). As a proud
American,
it embarasses me to see how narrow-minded this forum
is.
They seem ignorant to the fact that our international
subscribership
is growing (despite your frequent
measures of statistics), and I am
embarassed
at the level of discussion, sometimes.
I've written some
people before but I only
get nasty responses back. Obviously
some of
the people have watched it only on TV --
not that this is bad, in
fact, of course we wantmore and more fans. And I think Gymn
deserves
a lot of credit for educating the
"TV" fan. But sometimes
subscribers
present their TV-influenced opinions
as fact, and that is embarassing
to me as an American (because they are watching American TV,
and are
*so* biased towards American gymnasts). I
guess there's not much you
can
do. I detest the thought of the
Olympics in Atlanta next year.
Maybe I'll just unsubscribe for a few
months...
----------
I don't think the topics
is the solution to our mail problem.
Actually, I don't think we have
too much mail, as Gymn is all I get.
But I guess
that's a different story for those who get Gymn at
work.
:) Maybe if Gymners just tried harder to
post meaningful items...? We
have an ftp site with lots of good stuff (thanks!), and lots
of people
ask questions that they can get from
there.
----------
I think the sublists
would be a mixed blessing. As parents of a male
collegiate
gymnast, we have a strong focus on male gymnastics and
college
gymnastics. However, we have found
a lot of interesting
things in the general
coverage and wouldn't want to miss that.
Plus,
we print and post some of the gymn discussions at our local gym to
encourage
more people to stay informed and try out the gymn
site and
join gymn-l.
...The
structure of gymn serves as good focusing tool, but I
don't see
how that could work here because you
couldn't have a top down view.
[Topics] would narrow rather than broaden my
appreciation of
gymnastics.
----------
I
would encourage you not to fragment Gymn, as there
will be a huge
number of questions that are asked
over and over again becuase poeple
are not recieving all
subjects.
----------
I can't see the point in dividing gymn up. If
people don't want to
read something all they have
to do is hit the delete key. I
actually
like coming into uni
some days and having 150 emails to read!!
The thing that does annoy me
is the people who have a one word answer
to someone's question and post it to everyone. In my opinion, this is
what clutters up the forum. Meaningful posts would be my
preference.
----------
Doesn't matter to me
because I'd want them all anyway.
I would worry
about the confusion and
messages asking "how do I...", especially for
those
who are paying for email, but on the other hand, we could try it
(if folks want to) and discontinue it if it becomes a
problem.
[end]
------------------------------
End
of GYMN-L Digest - 13 Oct 1995 to 14 Oct 1995 - Special issue
*****************************************************************