gymn Digest Tue, 12 Apr 94 Volume 2 : Issue 102

Today's Topics:
Beginer (6 msgs)
British Team get sponsored.
Canada
Collegiate Scores...My Two (or four) cents (2 msgs)
Eurosport Coverage (2 msgs)
Foreign competitors (3 msgs)
Goodwill Games Team
Gymnastics Glass Sculptures
Hello
Help! Kent State is dropping
Inflated Collegiate Scores
Men's College Scores
NCAA Eastern Regionals
NCAA Northeast Region Results (women)
NCAA West Regional Results (Women)
NCAA West Regionals (women) Impressions (2 msgs)
Stretching.
Vertigo
Women's NCAA Champ. Seedings (unofficial) (2 msgs)
Women's NCAA rules (3 msgs)
Women's NCAA Team Qualifiers
Young gymnasts (2 msgs)

This is a digest of the gymn@athena.mit.edu mailing list.
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Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 09:09:45 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Beginer

Hello,
My name is Mary, and I am new to the mailing list. I am also new the
this sport by way of my daughter. My daughters name is Courtney and she is
6.5 years old. She started in gymnastic last November in just a once a week
*class*. It wasn't even a month and she was asked to be on the Mini Team.
They meet and practice(not compete) twice a week for 1.5 hours. After seeing
all the time they spent on stretching and strengthening, not *fun* stuff, I
didn't think she would last long. You know how long 6 year olds at
attention
spans are! She Loves It!!! Last month her coach recommended she be move to
thePre-Team. They practice three night a week(not compete) for 2 hours a
night. Being new to this, this is my question....Is this type of work out all
right for a child this age? They spend at least 45 minutes or more on
stretching and strengthening...which seems good...I have no idea. Her coach
told me she is very strong and has a lot of natural ability. I certainly
don't want to hold her back from developing her skills, but at the same time
I am concerned about the length of the work outs. She is very athletic
(started playing soccer at age 3). Also...Courtney doesn't seem to be able to
walk through the house anymore....she has to cartwheel or back flip or walk
on her hands!! It is obvious that she loves the sport...but its driving me
nuts!
Any sugetions? Besides padding the walls and floor?
I am looking forward to learning quite a bit and hope you all will be patient
with a new gymn Moms questions......Thank you
Mary

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 15:07:20 PDT
From: ***@eworld.com
Subject: Beginer

Mary:

Regarding your daughter Courtney, let me first say congratulations. You
clearly have quite an athlete on your hands if she has progressed so quickly.

You wrote:

>They {mini team} meet and practice(not compete) twice a week for 1.5 hours.

This is actually quite a moderate number of hours for mini team. Our program
that is similar to yours (we actually call it pre-team) works out three times
a week for 1.5 hours, and our actual mini-team (immediately pre-competition)
works out three times per week for 3.5 hours. None of the girls is much older
than Courtney.

I would say Courtney's coaches are being smart in moving her from 1 hour per
week to three hours. This is a nice gradual change. Because of the increase
in time spent conditioning (stretching, running, calesthenics) she may be a
little more tired at first than you are accustomed to seeing her, but she
will eventually catch up and be howling for more.

Every coach has different attitudes about the "proper" mix of conditioning
and actual work on apparatus. If you are concerned, don't hesitate to mention
it to the coach. You may want to ask to see a training program. Note that
gymnastics is a sport that places a LOT of emphasis on strength, so
conditioning is a major part of early training. Courtney is obviously tracked
for competition, so her coaches are (rightfully, in my opinion) focusing on
developing the fundamentals.

As far as suggestions...

1. Beware the Leotard Monster. Set a limit on the number of workout leos you
will buy each year, or you will find yourself buying one every two weeks.

2. Start setting money aside now for competition. I don't know if anyone has
run over the expenses with you yet, but as she moves into the competitive
levels gymnastics is going to absorb an ever-growing part of your
discretionary income.

3. If you have a question, ASK your coaches or the administrator of the gym.
You have a right to know what is going on, and no professional coach would
change the way he or she treats your child simply because you are asking a
lot of questions.

4. If you can swing it, pay the $60 and become a professional member of USA
Gymnastics (USGG.) You will learn an awful lot about the workings of
gymnastics that way.

5. Have Courtney subscribe to USA Gymnastics magazine, International Gymnast
magazine, or both. Make it clear to her that you want to read them as well.
They are also very helpful, if for no other reason than when Courtney starts
talking about "The Hilton Challenge", "round-off flip-flop back," or "Tatiana
Gutsu" she won't be speaking Greek.

Always a pleasure to put in my $0.02.

Sincerely,

David

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 22:23:52 EDT
From: t***@aluxpo.att.com
Subject: Beginer

Mary,

My strongest suggestion to a new gym mom is to make sure that your
daughter gets to experience many things while she's still young and still
has time - be it other sports, artistic or musical activities etc. .. because
if she continues with gymnastics, it won't be long until the hours and
commitment increases. You'll be happier knowing that gymnastcs has been a
choice...because there'll be a point where you'll probably be wondering
whether you ever should have let it get started to begin with.

Toby

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 94 1:43:38 PDT
From: <***@cisco.com>
Subject: Beginer

Also...Courtney doesn't seem to be able to walk through the house
anymore....she has to cartwheel or back flip or walk on her hands!! It
is obvious that she loves the sport...but its driving me nuts!

Be careful. You and your daughter both will be very unhappy if she
gets her most serious injury after doing a trick perfectly, and lands
on the corner of the living room coffee table or whatever. (heh. A
young Chops went around on crutches for a week or two after smacking a
similar table. He hadn't done the trick perfectly, though!)

We're house hunting. (Actually... Never mind.) A couple of houses
we looked at had tennis courts, and all I could think was that a
tennis court would be a good place to set up quite a bit of gymnastics
equipment...

Chops


------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 09:28:49 -0600 (EST)
From: <***@indiana.edu>
Subject: Beginer

Hi Mary,
I just thought I'd comment on some of the advice that you've been
receiving, especially the part about not letting your childs whole
life be consumed by gymnastics. It seems to be almost addictive to
some children. My daughter turned 10 in February. She's a level 9
and practices from 12 to 15 hours a week plus takes ballet and Jazz
to improve her floor and beam (another 3 hours a week). Plus she
continually practices at home. The clothes she wears to school are
gymnastics t-shirts and sweatshirts. She always wears a leotard
under her clothes. Most of her stories, and art projects she does for
school are about gymnastics. She used to love to play baseball and
even made the boys all-star team the summer before last. Now, she
just wants to do gymnastics. I'm going to sign her up for swimming
lessons this summer to try to keep her a little more normal. Another word
of caution, it's even addictive for the moms! You find yourself
reading gymnastics magazines watching it on T.V. and going to meets that
your kid is not even in!

However the worst part is when your kid starts doing the big tricks.
The first time your sweet little girl does a double back without spot,
or shows you her double fly a way off bars or a round-off double back
off beam, you'll problably get a severe stomach ache. This is natural.
But, the good part is: my daughter is the happiest child I know. She
acts like the entire world is her playground. She's much happier than
her brothers, she's confident, very mature for her age, makes excellent
grades. Her coaches and team give her another family that she's very
attached to. I have a full time job and a part time job and I'm a
single mom. but I must admit, it's worth it! I wish my boys would
have found something they were passionately interested in. (I'm
very fond of baseball and basketball) (unfortunately, they are not).
Good luck to your daughter and may she have as much fun as mine!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 94 11:29:47 EDT
From: ***@aluxpo.att.com
Subject: Beginer

Mary,

On the other hand, when your daughter reaches the next level (Sara's
11. L10) and practices 35 hours a week with three stress fractures and
two sprained ankles, one begins to have doubts - even if the kid is the
happiest in the world (or was before they started hurting so badly).

Toby

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 94 16:11:52 BST
From: ***@axion.bt.co.uk
Subject: British Team get sponsored.

The British Gymnastics team got a boost yesterday when it was
announced
they had been given #120,000 ($177,060) worth of sponsership from
Crosse & Blackwell (known most for making Branston Pickle), the
deal lasts three years and covers all forms of gymnastics.

Clive.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 18:33:15 -0400
From: <***@undergrad.math.uwaterloo.ca>
Subject: Canada

Hello, Bryan

Greetings from sunny (at last!) Waterloo, Ontario, Canada!!!!!!
Yes, there are Canadian subscribers to the Gymn News. I enjoy doing
gymnastics although I've never been at the competition level. The
closest I've ever come to competitive gymnastics is when I was a coach at
Gymnastics Mississauga at the time when Janine Rankin was still in
competition. I coached with Stella's sister, Stacey. The last four
years, I've been taking recreational classes at the Kitchener-Waterloo
Gymnastics Club. My ultimate goal is to do a
round-off-back-handspring-back-tuck line without a spotter. It's close. :)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 17:00:29 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Collegiate Scores...My Two (or four) cents

I know that, or it least it seems this way to me, there are more collegiate
gym people on line than international gym people ( by that imean as arena of
primary interest) so my comments may not endear me to many but I just had
to say something what with all the college reports and scores coming in...

Gimnasta touched on it...the infalted value of college scores. In almost
every collegiate meet I've ever seen (albeit not a vast amount) there's a
10.0. Usually for something that isn't even worth a ten except in the
"modified" code used by the NCAA. I know that the general logic is that a
crowd loves to see high scores but I'd beg to differ that good gymnastics
would keep a crowd more interested than high scores for low skills. Much is
made by commentators & supporters about the "high level of competition"
enjoyed by NCAA gymnastics. When people then turn to the International scene
what must they think? Do they think that these little girls are no good
because they score so much lower than their college counterparts? For most
people (myself included) even the most simple gymnastic skill is beyond their
ken...it's easy to impress the ignorant is my point; though I don't mean it
in nearly as condescending terms as those.

The same kind of problem exists in Men's vs Women's gymnastics most people
look at the much lower scores of men and think that the girls must be better
(also the media hype and bias leads towards this perception). Yes, the
AMERICAN elite girls are miles above the American men's team but over all on
the international scene it could be more than credibly argued that the men
have a much higher and much deeper level of difficulty (I won't state this
as fact, though I obviously belive it ito be so, for fear of serious
repriseals) than the women at this point in gymnastics history.

The point of this long winded dissertation (breveity is not one of my
strengths...nor is spelling, please forgive me) is that...Are we not doing
the atlhletes and fans alike a diservice my lowering the expectations of the
code and and raising their scores to a level that borders on the ridiculous?

Just my take on the thing,
Susan

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 20:41:43 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Collegiate Scores...My Two (or four) cents

>Are we not doing
the atlhletes and fans alike a diservice my lowering the expectations of the
code and and raising their scores to a level that borders on the ridiculous?

Valid point. Here's an example. I was talking to one man who qualified for
NCAA Nationals. The routine he did was worth 10 in collegiate competition,
but only 9.5 in elite (according to his calculation). If the US men can use
watered down routines in NCAA and still win, how can they be consistent at
doing higher difficulty when they compete internationally?

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 94 16:20:35 BST
From: ***@axion.bt.co.uk
Subject: Eurosport Coverage

I found out the times of the coverage of next weeks world
championships
so I thought I would post the times for you just as information
really. (All the times quoted are BST which is one hour ahead of
GMT and
no you can't receive Eurosport in America)

April 19th 7am - 12:30pm (live coverage)
April 20th 7am - 12:30pm (live coverage)
April 21st 7am - 12:30pm (live coverage)
April 22nd 7am - 12:30pm (live coverage)

The schedule only goes up to Friday 22nd April because they havent
published the next week yet.


Also as a point of interest I read today that Radio 5 Live in Britain
will be covering alot of the Commonwealth games including the
gymnastics by radio commentary. Should be interesting.

Clive

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 94 14:26:23 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Eurosport Coverage

>no you can't receive Eurosport in America)

April 19th 7am - 12:30pm (live coverage)
April 20th 7am - 12:30pm (live coverage)
April 21st 7am - 12:30pm (live coverage)
April 22nd 7am - 12:30pm (live coverage)

The schedule only goes up to Friday 22nd April because they havent
>published the next week yet.

We want Eurosport in America!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am sooo jealous! LIVE WORLDS!

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 17:07:53 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Foreign competitors

Subject for discussion:

Should taxpayer supported US universities be giving scholarships to non-US
citizens, particularly since financial aid (athletic or academic) has become
so hard to come by?

Also, related question: Should former state-supported Eastern-bloc athletes
(such as Hungarians) be allowed to receive US scholarships, when US athletes
that accepted money are banned?

Opinions.

Mara

P.S. I have visions of Lyudmila Stobchatayaia coming to college in the US
(probably for Utah) and performing the same floor routine for 4 MORE years...

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 94 2:06:02 PDT
From: <***@cisco.com>
Subject: Foreign competitors

Federal Funding should not be used to give athletic scholarships period.

In general, I don't think it is.

Athletics budgets can be largely met with alumni contributions, thus Penn's
(then new) president's (in)famous quote: "The three functions of a university
president are to maintain the sexual interests of the students, the parking
interests of the faculty, and the football interests of the alumni."

Too bad improving the football team apparently meant cutting the gymnastics
team.

Chops

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 15:40:30 PDT
From: ***@eworld.com
Subject: Foreign competitors

marael as usual has come up with a great topic.

>Should taxpayer supported US universities be giving scholarships to non-US
>citizens, particularly since financial aid (athletic or academic) has become
>so hard to come by?

Let's start by breaking the question into small pieces.

First, how would you define taxpayer-supported schools? Since many of the
private institutions of higher learning around the country are partially
supported by goventment, you would need to be very specific on this point.

Second, let's look at the flip-side of the question. Should
taxpayer-supported universities be PROHIBITED from giving scholarships to
non-US citizens? If you make this provision, you are artificially
handicapping Taxpayer Supported Schools in the favor of those that are
privately funded. This hardly seems equitable.

Clearly, you would either have to prohibit scholarships altogether (rather
hard to enforce) or leave it open to everyone. Since prohibiting scholarships
to outstanding athletes would be discriminatory against those athletes (since
foreigh scholars can freely receive scholarships) I would say this is
unworkable as well.

The bottom line is this: the decision should be made at a Board of Trustees
level to provide such a scholarship, since it involves a decision to
allocate scarce university resources. If the university feels it is an
appropriate use of funds, then it should be approved. But the process should
be open to review on a case-by-case basis, in ALL institutions.

If the NCAA were to promulgate these guidelines, I feel the intent to prevent
the over-allocation of resources could be maintained while offering foreign
athletes a chance at a U.S. education and offering U.S. universities the
opportunity to recruit the world's finest talent.

Lets face it--attendance at collegiate gymnastics events could be a LOT
better. Maybe the sport could be bouyed by the addition of some international
names to local rosters.

David

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 94 17:07:00 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Goodwill Games Team

>In 1990, they took the top four
opt'ls from USAs. This time they just let the selection Committee
pick the five athletes.

Did they pick them yet? It would seem very early to me (particularly before
Worlds)???

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 94 17:20:58 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Gymnastics Glass Sculptures

To All:
Looking for the perfect gift? There is a glass sculptor in California who
is fast becoming a favorite among gymnasts and fans for his glass designs of
gymnasts in action.
From necklaces to coffee-table art, his sculptures include gymnasts on the
beam, vault, bars and floor. The prices range from $20 to $135 (for an
all-around trophy).
I have ordered from this man, and his stuff is really, really good. I know
I sound like a salesman, but I have nothing to do with this company. I just
thought I'd let you all know in case you're looking for something special to
buy for that someone special.
To get a free color brochure, call Neon 1 at 714-592-2492 or write to:
Neon 1, 216 E. 5th Street, San Dimas, Calif., 91773.
-- Ron in Fla.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 13:27:21 -0500 (EST)
From: <***@gateway.us.sidwell.edu>
Subject: Hello

Hi,
My name's Lisa and I'm new to the list. I'm 14 years old and I'm
a Level 8. Just thought I'd say hi before I started putting in my two
cents...

Lisa

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 00:23:24 -0400 (edt)
From: <***@dorsai.dorsai.org>
Subject: Help! Kent State is dropping

Help! Kent State University just announced last week they are dropping
their Men's Gymnastics team for next year.

The final decision has not yet been made. The trustees vote Wednesday -
April 13, 1994

Please contact
Carol Cartwright
President
Kent State University
Kent, Ohio 44240

fax number 216-672-3281

A fax is the only way to reach her office in time. Please voice your
disapproval and encourage her to keep this constantly improving
collegiate team alive.

These athletes need your help now!

Sorry I don't have the voice number for the president's office.

Thanks for your help.

Ken

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 1994 19:29:19 -0500 (CDT)
From: <***@owlnet.rice.edu>
Subject: Inflated Collegiate Scores

First of all, to address Susan's remarks...

Gymn is not really that collegiate oriented-- it's just That Time Of
Year... I think a lot of people enjoy both.

Also, I second your opinion on inflated scores. I laugh to myself
every time the Gymnastics Insider arrives and there is the "running
scorecard" for 10's of the last two weeks. (TGI is a women's
collegiate newsletter, for those who don't know.) It's getting to the
point (some claim that point is long past) where the scoring is losing
any integrity that it had. Having to distinguish a "real 10" from the
other 10s takes away the value of the real 10. But that's just my
opinion. I understand how it creates excitement and how this attracts
fans and so forth -- I do see the benefits of the auto-10. But I
don't think it's worth the sacrifice, in the long run.

Then, Gimnasta asked if the men competed under a different Code. The
answer is yes, they do. The FIG base is 9.0, but the NACGC-Men voted
to use a base of 9.5 for the entire season, excepting event finals at
Nationals, where the base moves to 9.0 (to distinguish among the high
level of competitors with all those specialists in event finals). Of
course, with a 9.5 base, a gymnast only needs .5 of difficulty to be
scored out of a 10.0. The reasoning for 9.5 base was two-fold... one,
the men's scores wouldn't look so drastically poor in comparison to
the women, and two, they felt the guys were still transitioning to the
new Code. By their discussion it appeared that they intended to use
full FIG rules in the 95 season. I personally would prefer that they
used 9.0 for the whole season.

An interesting side effect is that the men who qualified as
specialists at regionals to Nationals did so under 9.5 (I believe),
but will have to compete under 9.0 rules. I've heard a bit of
sentiment that if they used 9.0 then a lot of guys would've qualified
as a specialist (like Kobylinski of Illinois on rings) that ended up
not making it, simply because of the sheer difficulty in their
routines.

On a side note, for those who didn't realize, the collegiate women
also compete under modified FIG rules. Correct me if I'm wrong (I'm
sure someone will, grin) but I believe collegiate women compete under
the 1993 Level 10 code (not the elite one that the top USA girls use),
and also, their vaulting is judged from the 1989 Level 10 code. The
NACGC-Women made some modifications to the code for their own use,
though, such as barring Yurchenkos and allowing the prone drop
(tumbling to land laying on the ground, like a punch front one and a
quarter).

Rachele

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 08:58:06 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Men's College Scores

I was noticing the high scores in the men's regional results (and on each
week's rankings) and was wondering whether they compete a modified Code, like
collegiate women do, or whether they just have inflation. If they compete a
different Code, is that a good idea, considering so many of the international
competitors are in college?

-- Gimnasta

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 94 17:06:50 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: NCAA Eastern Regionals

Here is some more detail from NCAA Men's East Regionals. I'll try to keep
this short, but if you want full detail, e-mail me.

Team (*qualified to NCAAs)
1. Ohio State 282.475* 2. Iowa 281.75* 3. Penn State 279.0* 4. Michigan
276.725 5. Ill-Chicago 276.4 6. Illinois 275.075

after 5 events, Iowa was leading OSU by .05. Iowa did so-so on high bar,
while OSU came on strong at rings to win. During practice, asst coach Miles
Avery said they were "training through" regionals, and focused on Big 10s and
Nationals. Afterwards, Head Coach Peter Kormann said his team made more
mistakes than he expected, but he planned to have them fine-tuned for
Nationals. I asked quite a few people (coaches, athletes, etc.) who they
felt would qualify, NOT ONE said Penn State.

All Around (*individual qualifiers to NCAAs)
1. Blaine Wilson OSU 56.775 (with a couple of falls!) 2. Kip Simons OSU
56.750 (also fell twice) 3. Garry Denk IOWA 56.450 4. Steve Marshall ARMY
56.3* 5. Danny Akerman TEMPLE 56.225* 6. Jay Thornton IOWA 56.15 7. Drew
Durbin OSU 56.1 (3 or 4 falls I think) 8. Goncalo Macedo ILLINOIS 56.0*
Others: 11. Bo Haun MINN 55.75 (Nat'l team member) 12. Brian Yee MINN
55.675 (Nat'l team member)

Minn's Brian Yee was a favorite to win, but 3 falls and he failed to qualify
AA. Tons of falls. Bruce was right, they haven't peaked yet (probably just
as well). Only Army (with a lot of home pressure) stayed solid.

Events (*individual qualifier to NCAAs)

Rings 1.Dave Frank TEMPLE 9.9* 2. Simons 9.8 3. Dave Eckert OSU 9.775 4.
Denk 9.75 4. Imad Haque ARMY 9.75* 6. Wilson 9.725 6. Dave Alexander OSU
9.725 8. Craig Holt SYRA 9.7*

Pbars 1. Barry McDonald Il-CHIC 9.8* 2. Simons 9.75 3. Alexander 9.7 3. Ben
Auzenne Wm&M 9.7* 5. Thornton 9.625 5. Frank 9.625*

Vault 1. Sebronzik Wright Wm&M 9.5* 1 Link Myers W.MICH 9.5* 3. Wilson & Denk
9.45 3. Rick Simonski Ill-CHIC 9.45* (also 3 but did not qualify due to
tiebreak) Ruslan Shupak MASS 9.45.

HiBar 1. Denk 9.85 2. Greg McGlaun ILL 9.75* 2. Tom Ellefson PENNST 9.75 4.
Brian Ottenhoff MINN 9.725* 5. Thornton 9.7 5. Rich Dopp MICH 9.7*

Ottenhoff had the best form in the meet. He dismounted only with a full-in,
but plans a triple back for Nationals. He told me the move made him very
leery after Kerry Huston's accident, and NCAAs will be the first time he
performs it this season. By the way, according to his teammates, Kerry is up
and around and progressing very well.

Floor 1. Thornton 9.825 2. James Lewis ARMY 9.8* 3. Wilson 9.75 3. Mark
Cooper PENNST 9.75 3. Raul Molina MICH 9.75* (one of the following three
qualified, I don't know which) 6. Welker, Wright & Braud 9.725

Lewis was clearly the best on floor, but suffered from not being with a team.
He showed some unusual combinations (start value 10): whip, direct 2 1/2
twist punch front & 2 whips, direct double twist punch front, high double
tuck. Rock solid. Is planning a more difficult third pass for NCAA event
finals.

PHorse 1. Durbin 9.9 2. Mike Sivulka ARMY 9.8* 3. Yee 9.75* 4. Jeff Kraft
W.MICH 9.7*

Sorry for being so longwinded.

Does anyone have results from Women's regionals or Men's West Regionals?

Mara

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 13:31:08 -0700 (PDT)
From: <***@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: NCAA Northeast Region Results (women)

These results were copied from the semi-official (pending overnight
verification) score sheets.

Team
New Hampshire 191.950
Penn State 191.475
Ohio State 189.075
Kent State 188.300
Rhode Island 187.875
U Mass 186.925
Temple 184.500

AA
1t. Olsson UNH 38.800
1t. Reardon UNH 38.800
3. Polito PSU 38.775
4. Stambaugh KSU 38.350
5. Mullins UNH 38.325
6. Pederson Penn 38.275


-Patrick

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 13:13:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: <***@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: NCAA West Regional Results (Women)

These are the semi-official (Inquiries, etc. accepted until
8:00 a.m. Sunday) results as of 11:00 p.m. Saturday.
(From the score sheets)

Team:
Vault Bars Beam Floor Total
UCLA 49.025 48.400 48.775 48.100 194.300
Oregon State 48.800 48.150 47.825 48.775 193.550
Washington 48.125 47.875 47.750 47.800 191.550
CSU Fullerton 47.325 48.125 47.975 47.850 191.275
California 47.925 47.400 47.900 46.800 190.025
Boise State 47.975 46.975 47.025 47.475 189.450
Stanford 47.175 46.850 48.000 46.750 188.775

AA (more places available)
VT UB BB FX Total
1. Chari Knight OSU 9.700 9.875 9.975 9.850 39.400
2. Leah Homma UCLA 9.825 9.925 9.900 9.675 39.325
3. Kareema Marrow UCLA 9.875 9.700 9.750 9.825 39.150
4. Celeste Delia CSUF 9.700 9.775 9.725 9.750 38.950
5. Marilyn Anderson OSU 9.675 9.600 9.700 9.650 38.625
6. Candice Kwok Cal 9.750 9.425 9.825 9.525 38.525

VT
1. Karen Nelson UCLA 9.925
2. Kareema Marrow UCLA 9.875
3t. Kerry Slater BSU 9.825
3t. Anne Vassallo OSU 9.825
3t. Leah Homma UCLA 9.825
3t. Lisa Washington Cal 9.825

UB
1. Leah Homma UCLA 9.925
2. Chari Knight OSU 9.875
3t. Hillary Anderson Stan 9.825
3t. Megan Fenton UCLA 9.825
5t. Cindy Tom Cal 9.800
5t. Catherine Williams UW 9.800

BB
1. Chari Knight OSU 9.975
2t. Cindy Tom Cal 9.900
2t. Leah Homma UCLA 9.900
4t. Candice Kwok Cal 9.825
4t. Karena Mills CSUF 9.825
6t. Hillary Anderson Stan 9.775
6t. Randi Miller OSU 9.775

FX
1. Chari Knight OSU 9.850
2. Kareema Marrow UCLA 9.825
3. Julie Wagner BSU 9.800
4t. Randi Miller OSU 9.775
4t. Amanda Turko OSU 9.775
6. Celeste Delia CSUF 9.750


These are only the scores. I photographed the meet and have some
impressions, but I have saved them for a separate posting.

-Patrick

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 17:19:37 -0700 (PDT)
From: <***@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: NCAA West Regionals (women) Impressions

I'll try to keep this brief, especially since I have other things
to do.

These may not be the impressions of most observers of the meet,
since I went as Stanford's photographer and was therefore watching
them more than anyone else. Ken Short (of Gymn Insider) was there,
though.

Unfortunately, "my" team has one of the worst performances of the
year. Early problems, especially on bars (2nd event after trick-weak
vault), led to pressure that affected later performances.

I didn't get to see many of OSU's performances, but they obviously
lost the meet on beam. It was nice to see Chari Knight back in form,
although she still has to wear a metal knee brace when she competes.

UCLA came to compete. They hit 24 for 24 and produced the biggest
individual treat for me. I was expecting Kareema Morrow's great
performances, but I hadn't heard about Leah Homma before this meet.
She was FANTASTIC. Her dance on floor was breathtaking (I tend to
watch it more than tumbling, since it's easier to photograph.), and
I was caught off guard by _Thomas flairs_ on both beam and floor.

Despite UCLA's uncharacteristically strong post-season showing, the
team surprise of the meet had to be Washington jumping from the
seven-seed to number three and (at last word) a nationals berth.
They didn't put up huge numbers on any event but simply came through
consistently on all events.

I didn't see much of the other teams (sorry), but in the all-around,
I have to say I'm disappointed that BSU's Julie Wagner and Stanford's
Jene Elzie won't be at nationals. Julie has been nursing a bad
ankle all season, and Jene would have made it if she had made
her (I think 2nd pass) double back. She landed way short and had
to roll forward.

Well, it's "next year" for Stanford, but this year's nationals should
be a fireworks show. If anyone else is going, please let me know
(especially if you know of a cheap place to stay).

-Patrick

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 10:31:09 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: NCAA West Regionals (women) Impressions

>I hadn't heard about Leah Homma before this meet.
She was FANTASTIC. Her dance on floor was breathtaking (I tend to
>watch it more than tumbling, since it's easier to photograph.), and
I was caught off guard by _Thomas flairs_ on both beam and floor.

This is where keeping up some on international gymnastics has relevance to
collegiate gymnastics. Leah was a top Canadian for a few years and has two
moves attributed to her in the Code (the flairs on floor are one, a
difficult-to-explain move where she jumps over her own leg on beam is the
other. She did [does?] the latter on floor, too, but it's not worth anything
there). I first saw her at Pan Am Junior Championships in 1988, and she
competed at Stuttgart in '89 (I think that was it for Worlds or Olympics;
correct me if I'm wrong. I can't check -- all my _IG_'s and results are at
home). She's also been up there in the NCAA rankings all season.

There's a pretty long list of successful international gymnasts from other
countries, especially Canada, who have competed (and are competing)
collegiately in the States. If I'm not mistaken, I think Alfonso Rodriguez
of Spain even won Nationals for Houston Baptist in the mid-80's.

-- Gimnasta

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 1994 16:09:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: ***@sas.upenn.edu
Subject: Stretching.

Can anyone recommend to me a good stretching book? Or can anyone tell me a
good stretching program to follow, or should I just stretch out everything
at the end of my workouts and on my off days? Thank you.

Glenn

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 11:13:38 +0800
From: ***@Eng.Sun.COM
Subject: Vertigo

Great movie. But seriously, anybody out there get dizzy (or used to get
dizzy) while practicing high bar or uneven bars? If so, do you get used
to it? Is there something that can be done to help get the body used to
swinging like that? My impulse is just to swing more, but, since I'm
sitting on such a valuable gymnastics resource (gymn) I thought I'd ask.
Might make for a good thread ;^)

I've finally learned both type of giants without needing a spotter.
Naturally, I'd like to connect the two. A cool sequence would be: hop
kip, cast, front giant, front giant, pirouette, regular giant, regular
giant, then the rest of the routine. Last night I was trying to get up
the nerve to do the pirouette, when I realized that three or four front
giants makes me real dizzy. No big deal if your just swinging, but the
bar looks kind of like it's wandering around there when I go to pirouette
over the top. Instead of just trying to release and regrasp a fictitious
bar, I just bail. Maybe I'm being a big baby, but will this sensation
ever go away, or should I just get used to it?

-George

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 1994 13:49:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: <***@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Women's NCAA Champ. Seedings (unofficial)

These are the seedings that were expected by Boise State's
Sports Info Office at 12:00 am Sunday (from unofficial results
from all regions)

1. Alabama 196.900 (Southeast)
2. Georgia 196.775 (Central)
3. Louisiana St. 194.400 (Central)
4. UCLA 194.300 (West)
5. Utah 194.100 (Midwest)
6. Michigan 193.600 (Central)
7. Oregon St. 193.550 (West)
8. Brigham Young 192.825 (Midwest)
9. Florida 192.550 (Southeast)
10. New Hampshire 191.950 (Northeast)
11. Arizona St 191.875 (Midwest)
12. Washington 191.550 (West)

(note, also unofficially
13t. Auburn 191.475
13t. Penn St 191.475)

If these results stand, two teams missed nationals by less than
a tenth, although I heard a rumor as I was leaving West Regionals
that Washington might not have qualified. Let me (us) know if
any of these scores/qualifiers are not correct.

-Patrick

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 94 21:46:37 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Women's NCAA Champ. Seedings (unofficial)

>(note, also unofficially
13t. Auburn 191.475
13t. Penn St 191.475)

If for some reason (I know not likely) a higher ranked team could not
compete, how would they break this tie? (Essentially, how would they break a
12th place tie). Also, how would they (or would they) break a higher ranked
tie for seeding purposes?

M

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 17:07:46 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Women's NCAA rules

Just watched the PAC-10s, and have a couple of questions.

The commentators said they only require 2 tumbling passes (one in
combination) on floor. ???????

They also said Leah Homma had the flairs on beam named after her because she
did them in 1989. I thought Tracee Talavera did them in the early 80s?

M

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 94 18:00:05 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Women's NCAA rules

>They also said Leah Homma had the flairs on beam named after her because she
did them in 1989. I thought Tracee Talavera did them in the early 80s?

Tracee Talavera did a single flair in the middle of her routine. Leah does a
flair mount series which she debuted internationally in 1989 and that is
what is named after her not the flair itself which is named after Kurt Thomas
even when done in women's gym...as the Yurchenko is still a Yurchenko even
when done by Scherbo. Speaking of lack of Int'l knowledge anoung college fans
(remember Gimnasta was). I was at a UCLA meet a while back and when Leah did
her flair mount this women next to me freaked out and said "Oh my god I've
been telling the girls to do that for years..." I, being me, couldn't resist
and told her that Leah HAD been doing it for years and it was in fact named
after her. This woman, a UCLA "gym mom" (she was part of the booster group
that supported the team) didn't even know that Leah was Canadian (which they
announced at the beginning of the meet during introductions even) and had no
idea that she'd competed international through 1990. Ignorance is bliss eh?

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 11 Apr 1994 19:15:57 -0700 (PDT)
From: <***@leland.Stanford.EDU>
Subject: Women's NCAA rules

Mara writes:

> Just watched the PAC-10s, and have a couple of questions.
>
> The commentators said they only require 2 tumbling passes (one in
> combination) on floor. ???????
>

I may be wrong -- please don't hurt me if I am -- but I believe that
the code (even FIG) _requires_ only two passes, but it is difficult
to get all of the other required elements without a third. Plus, the
judges would probably nit-pick a routine with only two passes
enough to devalue it.

Also, WRT inflated college scores, the point of using an "easier"
code is not to increase 10.0's and let Georgia score 197(!), but
rather to allow schools such as (on the west coast) UC-Davis,
Cal State-Sacramento, etc. the chance to stay out of the 170's.
(Don't take this as a rag on these schools; the athletes there
may work harder than some of those at top schools, but most
don't have the same abilities.) Although
fans don't need to see 10.0's, they don't like to see the home
gymnasts all scoring below 9.0. It has the unfortunate side effect
of allowing top teams to start all of their values from 10.0, but
the coaches (of even the top schools) felt that the code should be
made easier for the sake of smaller schools. At least this is
my perception and recollection after sitting in on a coaches meeting
last year.

I personally think that the scoring "inflation" is unfortunate,
especially at Nationals. Someone could do a bar routine that
is barely worth a 10.0, do it "perfectly," and beat someone who does a
routine that would start from a 10.0 (or higher, if allowed) in elite
competition, has a slight form break during a giant, and scores a 9.9.

Then again, this problem exists even at the international level. To
change events, a "perfect" layout Tsuk full beats a layout Tsuk double
full (or is it just double?) with a minor break, since both are worth
a 10.0 (unless the new code changed this).

Yours in verbosity-
-Patrick

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Apr 94 17:20:44 EDT
From: ***@aol.com
Subject: Women's NCAA Team Qualifiers

To All:
Here are the 12 teams that have earned a berth to the NCAA National Women's
Gymnastics Championships, based on Saturday performances at five regional
sites nationwide:
1. Alabama 196.900
2. Georgia 196.775
3. LSU 194.400
4. UCLA 194.300
5. Utah 194.100
6. Michigan 193.600
7. Oregon State 193.550
8. BYU 192.825
9. Florida 192.550
10. New Hampshire 191.95
11. Arizona State 191.875
12. Washington 191.550
--- Ron in Fla.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 1994 11:51:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: ***@ocvaxa.cc.oberlin.edu
Subject: Young gymnasts

Mary,
It sounds like the pre-team is a good program at your gym. I'd like to
add on my comments to Toby's excellent advice-
1) Separate ballet classes are always a good thing for a developing
gymnast. Because I had scoliosis when I was five, I wasn't alowed to start gym
classes until I was 8 1/2, so I had to take ballet. It ended up being a
wonderful asset, because a lot of technique, esp. on beam and floor, is based
on ballet. It also develops coordinating actions to music and is a nice
complimentary, yet seperate, activity.
If money is a problem, a local parks & recreation department or other
supplemental programs are usually cheap. If time is a problem, go for the
carpool approach.
(As an interesting side note, my ballet teacher always had us on the
floor, stretching for half the class. She's in her late seventies now, and is
Evander Holyfield's personal stretching instructor!)
2) I have to put in a plug for music. It is a
wonderful thing to start kids in music at that age. If she doesn't keep up with
it, fine, but if you start a kid on piano or violin (two of the hardest
instruments coordination-wise. They can switch to other instruments easily if
started on one of these two....) before age 8, they can quickly pick it back up
later in life. It also builds hand-eye coordination, language (because of
reading music) and math skills, and, of course, the usual discipline and
achieving goals stuff. If she has any affinity toward music, school and/or a
private teacher (Suzuki, if possible) can provide a good set-up.
Sorry about the rambling....
Cara
P.S. On the workout leos subject - my gym would run a used leo sale, so we
could get cheap, cool leos that others had outgrown.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 12 Apr 94 11:52:28 PDT
From: ***@eworld.com
Subject: Young gymnasts

Cara wrote:

>P.S. On the workout leos subject - my gym would run a used leo sale, so we
>could get cheap, cool leos that others had outgrown.

Great idea. I just passed it on to our parent's club and we are going to have
one before the summer.

David

------------------------------

End of gymn Digest
******************************