GYMN-L Digest - 16 Apr 1996 to 17 Apr 1996 - Special issue
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There are 21 messages totalling 608 lines in this issue.

Topics in this special issue:

  1. RSG: Thais Intl. (3)
  2. Olympic History (3)
  3. Seneca College - Summer Gym Camp Schedules
  4. Oprah Winfrey...
  5. Oprah Show
  6. Oprah (2)
  7. Ruegge'
  8. 1992 gym tv coverage
  9. Oprah tape copy
 10. <No subject given> (2)
 11. Worlds Men's Results after Subdiv 1
 12. Amanda Borden!
 13. Jaycie Phelps
 14. Worlds - W Roster RUS, USA, CAN
 15. Worlds Men's Canadian Results


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 05:18:39 -0700
From:    ***@NETCOM.COM
Subject: RSG: Thais Intl.

>From Monday's _l'Equipe_:

1.  Popova (UKR)      9.650
2.  Serrano (FRA)     9.625
3.  Vatkina (BLR)     9.575

1.  Serrano (FRA)     9.775
2.  Perepelitsa (BLR) 9.650
3.  Popova (UKR)      9.625

1.  Serrano (FRA)     9.750
2.  Perepelitsa (BLR) 9.650
3.  Vatkina (BLR)     9.625

1.  Popova (UKR)      9.675
2.  Vatkina (BLR)     9.600
3.  Perepelitsa (BLR) 9.575

Debbie :-)


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 08:11:13 -0400
From:    ***@EAGLE.LHUP.EDU
Subject: Olympic History

Did anyone get to see the excellent documentary on Olympic History aired
on TBS last night?  It showed some great old footage of Ludmilla
Tourischeva as well as some other gymnastics greats.  Check the listings
because I think it will be aired again.  It is a great Olympic history



Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 10:45:02 EST
Subject: Seneca College - Summer Gym Camp Schedules

Seneca College in Toronto, Ontario will again offer a wide range of summer
camps for gymnasts and tumblers. Information and scheduling is located at:


or  call (416) 493-4144.

REMEMBER. Bring your kids to our open house on Thursday, April 25, 6-8 pm
in the West Gym, Newnham Campus, 1750 Finch (at Hwy 404), North York and
help us make this the best Summer yet!



Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 10:51:15 EST
From:    ***@MMC.MARYMT.EDU
Subject: Oprah Winfrey...

Hey fellow gymners!

I know that this is something that a lot of you don't want to hear
but it's just my opinion and you don't have to agree.  I'm glad that
Oprah did her show on the "negative" side of gymnastics.  Don't get
me wrong...I love gymnastics dearly.  I just think that the show
brought up topics in the world of gymnastics that have been denied by
USAG and the gymnastics communtiy for too long.  The fact is that
there ARE negative sides to the sport as there is with anything else.
When we watch gymnastics on TV, we are constantly seeing the
"positive" side of the sport.  The only thing that I don't agree with
(in terms of the show) was that Oprah made it seem that all
gymnastics (at the elite level) is abusive...and it's not.  She
should have made it clearer to viewers that it was only focusing on
the negative effects of the sport.  Just my $0.02.  Flame Away!

Nikki =]


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 11:03:38 -0400
From:    ***@AOL.COM
Subject: Re: Oprah Show

I have been reading all of your posts and I agree with every one of you.  I
did hear during the program when they said that the lower levels of the sport
were great for the girls and that the focus for the show was mainly on the
elite levels.  But I still wonder about all the girls in the lower level who
are striving for a college scholarship.  That is one of my daughters goals at
the moment.  I did tape the show but I don't think I will let my daughter
watch it unless I am in the room with her to answer her questions.  Most
likely I will let her watch it only because Betty Okino was featured.  She is
one of my daughters role models I think because she (Betty) got her start at
our gym when she was eight. With her talent, she didn't stay there very long.
 As soon as they saw her potential, they moved her up to a gym better equiped
to develope her skill.

Many of you have asked for Oprah's e-mail address, so I went searching
through AoL.
In her message board where they post all of the topics and the feedback, I
found possibly what looks like the producer. She posted a little info on the
subject such as who was featured and said what book they were promoting.  If
you want to voice your opinions I think they will get circulated if you use
If anyone would like a copy of the show I would be willing to make copies for
you, just e-mail me privately so we can set it up.

Proud mother of
two gymnasts


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 11:06:25 -0400
Subject: Re: Oprah

Thus far, I have mainly been an observer to the goings on on this =
mailing list (lurking and listening) but maybe the time has come for =
some of the people involved in the sport to speak up and be heard.

I read Joan Ryan's book last summer, and i watched the Oprah show last =
night.  It is my feeling that everything said on the show yesterday was =
true and valid and needed to be said. (Let the Flames begin:)

A little about myself

I am the Head coach at a successful  club in Southern Ontario. I have =
been coaching professionally since 1983.

I have coached female and male athletes at the  kindergym, recreational, =
regional, provincial and national levels so feel I have got a least a =
fair grasp of the workings of this game we call gymnastics. The opinions =
I am going to express come from the years I have spent IN the sport.

I do not believe that anyone lied on Oprah yesterday.  I also think that =
many of the things that were said need to be said.  I think in some =
cases maybe the show doesn't go far enough.

First of all - the topic of the show was not about giving an equal =
representation of the positive and negative aspects of gymnastics. It =
was about the negative side.  I am pretty sure that the Olympics this =
summer will do a fine job of glamourizing the sport without showing the =
negative side of it:)

I felt that the show fairly presented some VERY important points.

1. That ELITE gymnastics has developed to a point where many  ELITE =
female athletes are leaving the sport with major problems (Physical, or =

2. That there are coaches out there who are abusing the incredible power =
they have (since they deal with children) to achieve the ends they want.

3. That there are parents out there who are blinded by dreams of glory =
and push their children far beyond their abilities.

I feel these points need to be raised in order to protect the integrity =
of our wonderful sport, and to protect the many clubs,parents, and =
coaches who know that gymnastics can be the BEST sport for children to =
participate in.

Women's Elite gymnastics CAN be legitimized child abuse at the VERY =
highest level.  On a recent CBC documentary I believe Svetlana Degteva, =
coach of many of Canada's National team members and mother of one of =
canada's top gymnasts said it best.  The jist of what she said was this.

In the Soviet Union my daughter was a very good gymnast. She was moved =
away from her home to train.  She trained 6 days a week for 7 hours.  =
She had NO LIFE.  She was an excellent gymnast.  In Canada my daughter =
is very happy, she has a life, she is a good student, she has many =
friends but she doesn't do excellent gymnastics. (This is my =
interpretation of her quote)

As coaches and parents we need to evaluate this profound statement.

At what cost excellence?

Should athletes have to have NO LIFE just to try to make the Olympics? =
After all, how many girls go to the olympics (Not very many from Canada =
this cycle). and truly not very many period.  My answer would be a =
resounding NO!!! (probably why I will never be a GREAT coach)

The dilemma is this.  If coaches are  hired and sell their program based =
on the premise that they produces champions, parents come to the gym and =
say "If you my daughter doesn't win the next meet I am taking her to =
another Club and governments  say we will give you funding based on =
whether you win medals, then amateur sports at the HIGHEST level are NOT =
a game YOUNGSTERS should be playing, whether it is gymnastics, figure =
skating, diving or hockey!!

Anyways enough of the negative, what can we do about it?????

As Parents:  Put your kids in sports to learn about life not to win a =
bunch of medals.  Put them in gymnastics so they will gain self =
confidence that will let them be all they can be later in life. Don't =
care whether they are level 1 or elite.  Care that they do the best they =
Come out and watch your kids do gym every now and again! Who cares if =
they win lots of medals when they are starting out? Let them enjoy the =

As Coaches: Don't sell your program based on performance, sell it based =
on teaching kids about life. Do the best you can to help each athlete be =
the best THEY can, not as good as you want them to be. Develop many =
levels of athletes all participating in competition rather than =
selecting a choice few!  Teach kids about life, not about winning.  =
Teach them to deal with winning with humility, and losing with grace.  =
Teach them never to give up!  Teach them to believe that they can!!!!  =
Build them up, don't tear them down!=20

While I know nearly all coaches and parents out there are following =
this, if even one or two take a look and change, then my little rant =
will have been worth it.

I LOVE Gymnastics.  Over the years my love has increased not decreased!  =
I think without a doubt that it is a game I would love for my youngster =
to play (if I had a youngster:).  It teaches so many great things. As a =
coach I have come from wanting to produce Olympic Athletes to wanting to =
produce good people.  I am confident now that this is what gymnastics is =
about and it is what the people at my club want. A couple of stories to =
close with.

My Senior High performance Athlete recently came and told me she REALLY =
wanted to be on her school track team. (It is her first year of High =
School)She trains about 20 hours a week and this would mean she would =
miss a couple of hours a week.  How could i say no.  She already misses =
lots of things her friends do.  My gymnast will probably not make Senior =
high performance next year but she comes to gym with a smile, and plans =
to stay in gym till university.

At a recent meet one of our 15 year old gymnasts who is a dedicated hard =
worker) captured the sixth and final spot to make the provincials in =
Senior 2 (similar to level 8)
She had missed the first meet due to a death in her family, so she =
needed a big result. however 2 weeks before the meet she got scared of =
"everything backward". 10 years ago I would've ranted and raved and =
probably pulled her out of the meet. Instead we told her it would be OK =
and to believe she would do her skills (even though she was still scared =
of some things on the eve of the meet).  The bottom line is she went to =
beam as last event with two other girls .1 ahead of her and rocked a =
beam routine to make the team by .05 (granted there were no backward =
moves in the routine:).  I know she will get over being scared of the =
skills, but the lessons she learned by keeping faith and trying all the =
way through will stay with her forever.  This girl's making provincials =
will always be one of my greatest coaching achievements. (and she will =
never be in the olympics)

When I first got into this business a very wise coach told me "We use =
gymnastics to teach kids life" I argued a lot that it was about winning =
not life.  Well Tak I just wanted you to know I did get the message:)

Yours in Sport,



Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 10:13:08 -0600
Subject: Re: Olympic History

I did. It was coo.. I thought that they might show more gymnastics, though
they did talk about 1972 and 1976. They even talked about Mens!!!



Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 10:16:51 -0600
Subject: Re: Oprah

All they needed was Mary Lou. Her presence would have been enough.



Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 11:21:30 EST
From:    ***@MAIL.FIRN.EDU
Subject: Ruegge'

I would like to personally thank the two of you for letting everyone on the
forum be aware of your time spent with Kim Zmeskal!  It is so nice to get
straight-forward, true information from a reliable source!


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 11:27:04 -0400
From:    ***@YORKU.CA
Subject: Re: RSG: Thais Intl.

> Rope
> 1.  Popova (UKR)      9.650
> 2.  Serrano (FRA)     9.625
> 3.  Vatkina (BLR)     9.575
        Now I don't follow RSG too closely, but isn't Popova from
Bulgaria?  I assume this is Diana Popova?


Date:    Wed, 17 Apr 1996 01:38:02 +1000
From:    ***@OZEMAIL.COM.AU
Subject: 1992 gym tv coverage

This is directed more to Aussie gymner's.  In about November or December
of 1992, there was an International competition on television.  I only saw
results.  It was on in the afternoon.  It had the womens's floor exercise
results.  It had Henrietta Onodi in about fourth.  Cristina Bontas won.  If
someone can give me details on this comp and also the name, I'd gretaly
appreciate it.  Thanks.  Matt


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 15:41:38 GMT
From:    ***@NOBLESNET.ORG
Subject: Oprah tape copy

I missed the Oprah show due to the Boston Marathon. I would really appreciate
a copy from anyone who has one. (I will pay for tape and shipping) I would
rather not buy one from the show., because I would rather not promote such a
poor job of showing both sides of the story.  My e-mail address is


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 10:00:26 -0700
From:    ***@NETCOM.COM
Subject: Re: RSG: Thais Intl.

> > Rope
> > 1.  Popova (UKR)      9.650
> > 2.  Serrano (FRA)     9.625
> > 3.  Vatkina (BLR)     9.575
>         Now I don't follow RSG too closely, but isn't Popova from
> Bulgaria?  I assume this is Diana Popova?

_l'Equipe_ didn't list first names, so there's no way to know for sure.



Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 13:42:04 -0400
Subject: Re: Olympic History

>Did anyone get to see the excellent documentary on Olympic History aired
>on TBS last night?  It showed some great old footage of Ludmilla
>Tourischeva as well as some other gymnastics greats.  Check the listings
It was a great Olympic history lesson but I felt it was unevenly edited.
Some atheletes' stories getting too much time and some not enough.

Gymnastics got not enough, but it was great to see Ludmilla Tourischeva
again.  Strange to see her grown up after many years of her young appearance.
She looks great.  They also gave a brief view of gymnastic Olympic
highlights , as well as a view of Olympic history.

I believe TBS will show it again tonite, Tuesday 4/16.


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 15:10:26 -0400
From:    ***@AOL.COM
Subject: <No subject given>

 that Shannon Miller and Domonique Moceanu aren't competing at worlds
because of injuries, but what about Kerri Strug?  Why isn't she there?
Just wondering.....



Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 16:11:53 -0400
From:    ***@AOL.COM
Subject: <No subject given>

h comp. and optional experiance. Full time work
in sunny So. Ca.. We are presently trainning international elites and have
many young talented athletes preparing to move up to a large optional
program. Must be knowledgeable and ready to work just as hard as our gymnasts
do. Contact or send resume to Gliders, Stephen Rybacki, 841 N. Dodsworth,
Covina, Ca. 91724.


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 17:50:51 -0400
Subject: Worlds Men's Results after Subdiv 1

April 16, 1996

Men's Preliminaries

Subdivision 1 of 2

Canadian Men:

FX: Alan Nolet     9.225  8th Stuck full-in dismount

PH: Roshan Amendra 8.975 11th Solid

R:  Roshan Amendra 8.775 18th

V:  Peter Schmid   9.425  7th Tsuk 1.5 in The Zone, 1 step

PB: Rob Doyle      8.825 16th

HB: Alan Nolet     9.450  5th Kovacs, 1-arm pike Tkatchev, stuck dismount

No falls!


FX: Alexei Voropaev  RUS 9.687

PH: KIM Hyon Il      PRK 9.687

R:  Ivan Ivankov     BLR 9.650

V:  YEO Hong-Chul    KOR 9.712

PB: Rustam Charipov  UKR 9.600

HB: Jari Monkkonen   FIN 9.550

I will post final prelims after Subdivision 2.  Gotta get food.

Buenos nachos,



Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 15:03:28 -0700
From:    ***@IX.NETCOM.COM
Subject: Amanda Borden!

Hi guys!!

This afternoon/evening we were watching tv and Amanda Borden was on the
news. It wasn't a story about her, she was actually reporting the
story! It was about teenagers getting scholarships. She did a great
job. At the end she was on the actually news set and talked with the
anchor people. They mentioned that she got a scholarship the Georgia
and how she delayed it to train for the Olympics. She is going to now
be seen as a "regular reporter" for the news (Channel 9)-I guess that
means she will do an occassional story. We will keep you updated of
course :)
She also mentioned that the US won the meet in FL and she won the beam.
I just thought I would point out that Amanda has awesome taste in
clothes everytime I have seen her :) THought I'd share! Bye for now!

M & M  :)


Date:    Tue, 16 Apr 1996 15:09:54 -0700
From:    ***@IX.NETCOM.COM
Subject: Jaycie Phelps


Yesterday in the newspaper there was an article about Jaycie Phelps. It
was pretty long :) And there was a picture of her on the beam. We
thought we would just summarize it up for those interested, and if you
just drop us an email we would be happy to send you the complete
article. It just briefly said that Jaycie was going to the Worlds this
week and she says that by doing this she feels that the judges can get
more familiar with her. Mary Lee says it is a great chance for her to
prove to herself that she can do it and it will give her more
confidence. In the meantime Amanda Borden has been recovering from a
fractured hand and will be training for the Classics in May. That is
just briefly it. Bye for now!!!!!

M & M :)


Date:    Wed, 17 Apr 1996 00:34:41 -0400
Subject: Worlds - W Roster RUS, USA, CAN

Finally, Russia, USA, and Canada (amongst most countries) had to make their
tough choices for Wednesdya's preliminary competition.

    I            II          III
VT: Galieva                  Khorkina
    Powell       Chow
                 MacEachern  Tousek
UB: Kotchetkova              Khorkina
                 Cousineau   Tousek
BB: Galieva                  Khorkina
                 Exaltacion  Tousek
FX: Kotchetkova              Kotchetkova
    Powell       Dawes
                 MacEachern  Tousek



Date:    Wed, 17 Apr 1996 00:37:48 -0400
Subject: Worlds Men's Canadian Results

April 16, 1996

Men's Preliminaries

(Subdivision 2 of 2)

Canadian Men:

Canadian men Kris Burley, Alan Nolet, and Richard Ikeda tonight have
 demonstrated to the Canadian Olympic Association that they have earned three
 individual positions for the 1996 Olympic Games.  By qualifying in the top 18,
 Canada may now assuredly be represented by these fine gymnasts.  As well, by
 placing in the top 16, they have qualified for the semi-final round to be held
 on Thursday April 18th -- Kris on floor, Alan on high bar, and Richard on
 parallel bars and high bar!

Also of note, Peter Schmid and Kris Burley tied in 21st place with the 15th
 highest scores.

Kris Burley showed his new floor routine which opens with a full-in full-out
 tucked, returns with a ro-whip-back 1.5 layout-front layout full, transitions
 with a front handspring- front layout full, and closed with a full-in tucked.

CBC Sports will present these semi-finalists on Saturday April 27th, 4:30-6:00pm

FX: Alan Nolet     9.225 27th Stuck full-in dismount

    Kris Burley    9.500 11th !!!!

    PH: Roshan Amendra 8.975 34th Solid

        Richard Ikeda  8.950 37th Fell :(

        R:  Roshan Amendra 8.775 48th

            Alan Nolet     9.275 26th

            V:  Peter Schmid   9.425 21st Tsuk 1.5 in The Zone, 1 step

                Kris Burley    9.425 21st RO half-on front tuck

                PB: Rob Doyle      8.825 46th

                    Richard Ikeda  9.450 11th !!!!

                    HB: Richard Ikeda  9.525  9th !!!!

                        Alan Nolet     9.450 15th !!!! Kovacs, 1-arm pike Tkatchev, stuck dismount

                        Well done, Gentlemen!


End of GYMN-L Digest - 16 Apr 1996 to 17 Apr 1996 - Special issue