GYMN-L Digest - 3 Jun 1996 to 4 Jun 1996 - Special issue

There are 23 messages totalling 606 lines in this issue.

Topics in this special issue:

  1. RSG Natls. - EF
  2. USA:Olympic tikcet delivery
  3. GYMN-L Digest - 18 May 1996 to 19 May 1996
  4. 1984
  5. TLC program
  6. Returning list member - with questions
  7. Compulsory routine on beam (international level)
  8. Thanks!
  9. rhythmics nationals
 10. TV and GYMN:  general
 11. College Gymnastics
 12. digests
 13. FLEETCENTER Men's Olympic Trials
 14. question re: Olympic Trials
 15. TLC program and Jaime Hill (was TV and GYMN: general)
 16. Marinescu profile (2)
 17. Canadian "where are they now" answers
 18. Old-Timers Meet
 19. Article on Chinese Women Gymnasts -- Mo and Meng
 20. <No subject given>
 21. RSG European all around results-HELP!!!
 22. USA RSG Nationals


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 08:15:32 -0400
From:    ***@CLOUD9.NET
Subject: RSG Natls. - EF

Today's New York Times reports that Jessica Davis won all 4 event finals
at RSG Nationals yesterday -- rope (9.449), ball (9.416), clubs (9.532)
and ribbon (9.516).  Natalie Lacuesta was 2nd in rope with 9.416 and
ribbon (9.283).



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 09:43:16 -0400
Subject: USA:Olympic tikcet delivery

Hello all:

Just heard that olympic tickets (that were ordered through the mail in
system last year) are ready to be shipped this week (June 3 - 8)  All
packages are slated to be delivered by June 10 by UPS.  As some of you have
been asking, I thought I would let folks know the tickets are on there way.



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 10:50:29 -0400
From:    ***@CORNELL.EDU
Subject: Re: GYMN-L Digest - 18 May 1996 to 19 May 1996

>In your post regarding the Men's Illinois High School Champs you
>described a gymnast doing this skill:
>                RUNNING FRONT-RO-FF-FF- full twist directly into
>                a split (UGH!!!!)
>Are you sure this is correct?  Now I may not have technical expertise
>in MAG but this skill seems very dangerous not to mention extremely
>painful--couldnt help wincing when I read it.

There was a guy at JMU - sometime around '90-'92 who used to do a double
full to splits - seems to me that any guy who can do tumbling to splits
deserves full bonus!

 I would be interested
>to hear what the value of this skill is.  My guess it would be an E
>for guts alone.  Then again gymnastics is nothing without the risk

Anyone know value of either of these tricks???


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 10:56:29 -0400
Subject: 1984

Twelve years ago today, at the Men's US Olympic Trials in Jacksonville,
Florida, Peter Vidmar, who won the Trials, and his teammates took a big step
toward the Gold.  So, Peter, Bart Conner, Mitch Gaylord, Tim Daggett, Jim
Hartung, and Scott Johnson, thanks for the great memories!  It doesn't seem
possible that was 12 years ago.  I remember the date well though because
this is Peter's birthday.  Happy birthday Pete!



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 11:53:00 EDT
From:    ***@PSUVM.PSU.EDU
Subject: TLC program

Does anyone know the exact title of the program the featured Lavinia
Milsovici on the Learning Channel?  I really want to keep my eyes open
for a re-broadcast.  Thanks a lot.  Also, does anyone know what the US
women's leotards will look like for the Olympics?  -Joy


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 12:05:56 -0400
Subject: Returning list member - with questions

Hi all. I'm back from hiatus. And I've got three <dumb> questions.

1. Has the women's artistic team been picked yet?

2. Any chance of Amanda Borden being on the team?

3. Anyone want me to take a mess of photos at the women's podium

--- Jeff


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 09:38:50 -0700
From:    ***@HALCYON.COM
Subject: Compulsory routine on beam (international level)

Can somebody describe me the compulsory routine on beam? Thanks


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 13:47:56 -0400
From:    ***@AOL.COM
Subject: Thanks!

I just wanted to say THANK YOU SO MUCH to the people who e-mailed me and
helped me with my Spanish presentation on gymnastics.  Especially ADRIANA and
AMY.  It went really well, and the teacher (from Cuba) was impressed with my
knowledge of the vocab.  Also, after everyone gave their presentation, there
was still time left at the end of the period.  The class wanted to watch the
gymnastics video I had used in my presentation!  So we ended up watching the
floor finals at the PUR worlds!  (In case anyone was wondering, the class
thought Gemma Paz jumped around too much and they liked Gogean the best)  :)

Also, for some reason, I can't get to the web site that shows the results of
the Grand Pris, but if Kotchetkova really did place on every event, I think
that's great!  I haven't seen her be consistant since the Goodwill Games.  I
think she's one of the best "packages" in Women's gymnastics today, along
with Pods, Mo, and Khorkina.  My guess is one of them will win in Atlanta.
 IMHO, Moceanu doesn't stand a chance.



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 13:32:10 -0500
Subject: rhythmics nationals

Here are the event finals results of the Rhythmic Gymnastics
Championships (Athens, GA), from today's Chicago Tribune:
Rope:  1. J. Davis- 9.449, 2. N. Lacuesta- 9.416, 3. L. Illy-
             9.316, 4. T. Tharp- 9.299, 5. K. Lee- 8.90.
Ball:  1. J. Davis- 9.416, 2. T. Tharp- 9.333, 3. N. Lacuesta-
           9.316, 4. A. Albe- 9.249, 5. L. Higa- 9.233
Clubs:  1. J. Davis- 9.532, 2. A. Albe- 9.299, 3. N. Lacuesta-
              9.266, 4. L. Illy- 9.249, 5. K. Kemper- 9.099
Ribbon:  1. J. Davis- 9.516, 2. N. Lacuesta- 9.283, 3. L. Illy-
                 9.249, 4. L. Higa- 9.15, 5. S. Chernenko- 9.083
Rope:  1. K. Scharringhausen- 9.0, 2. K. Jeffress- 8.967, 3. H.
              Isaacs- 8.933, 4. J. Shoemaker- 8.817
Hoop:  1. J. Shoemaker- 9.217, 2. T. McCargo- 9.20, 3. D.
              Lord- 8.767, 4. K. Scharringhausen- 8.70
Clubs:  1. J. Shoemaker- 9.167, 2. T. McCargo- 8.983, 3. H.
              Isaacs- 8.90, 4. K. Jeffress- 8.783
Ribbon:  1. J. Shoemaker- 9.183, 2. T. McCargo- 9.00, 3. A.
                 Ng- 8.85, 4. K. Jeffress- 8.70



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 15:49:41 -0400
Subject: TV and GYMN:  general

On Mon, 3 Jun 1996, Automatic digest processor wrote:

Did the Canadian English broadcast show any of Marinescu's beam?

I've been away from my regular email address for a long time, and I
wasn't able to write, but I do have a compilation of questions.....

First, for Canadian viewers:

In the 1993 Canadian Championships, where Stella Umeh and Curtis Hibbart
(sp) won, there were several gymnasts that have since faded out of the
picture. Among these are Jaime Hill, Laura Chow, Darren (?), and Sarah
Cain.  Does anyone know what happened to them?

My CBS station didn't show any meets this year.  Does anyone know if
there's anything I can do about this?

Finally, I'm looking for penpals from anywhere in the world.  I can speak
some french if that's a more comfortable language.  I love to debate and
discuss, and I try to keep in touch with all my penpals.  I also belong
to AOL, so chatting there or in ESPN chat rooms would also be a possibility.

Please Email at (or the address listed at the
top of this message.  For some reason it seems as though it may have
changed).  I can also be reached at, but not until the
11th of June.

For now,

(Hey Vanessa, by the time you read this you'll hopefully have a nice
round medal hung around your neck.  Good luck at Natls! )


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 13:19:08 PDT
From:    ***@CISCO.COM
Subject: Re: College Gymnastics

    I heard that some college gymnastics teams will accept anyone, is that
    true?  Since I am currently not competing at the elite level, I am
    worried about competing for a college in a year.

In college gymnastics, there are several different levels of competition.
If the college you are going to is NOT competing on an NCAA nationwide
level, it may very well accept "anyone" on the team, if it has a team, or
for the gymnastics club.  In general, such schools will compete against
other schools of similar talent level, and everyone has a good time even if
the top scores are 6s and 7s.  [This info is close to 20 years old.  Things
may have changed.  In particular, I think a lot of schools have dropped
gymnastics altogether.]  For example, when I went to U of P (an "Ivy
league" school with generally crappy athletics, and no atheletic
scholarships), some of our team members were "new" to gymnastics, and the
low scores during a meet would sometimes be very low indeed.  Scores in
the mid 7s would get you first place at Ivy championships...

    How does getting on a college team work anyway?
    Is there a tryout usually or what?

At Penn, you showed up and worked out.  If you looked promising, you were
on the team.  Shortly before each meet, the coach would pick the competing
lineup based on how everyone was looking (performance, injury, and "who
showed up" wise.)  If you worked out for a while without showing any
promise, you tended to drift away on your own (I think.  Perhaps there was
a conversation with the coach involved.)  This works fine up to a certain
number of people.  In fact, we regularly had people work out with us who
were ineligible for one reason or another.  Men's gymnastics isn't a very
popular support, and sometimes the challenge is getting enough people, not
turning away gymnasts who aren't "elite".

    I have e-mailed two coaches of colleges I want to go to about 2 weeks
    ago and havent heard any response yet.

Gymnastics coaches are NOT famous for their computer literacy.  Try a
phone.  The admissions department may be able to help you get in touch, or
get you info on the team that would indicate whether you can "make it" (ie
meet scores.)  In my case, I was quite sure I wanted to compete, and my
college visits included working out with the teams (the coaches had no
problem with this.)  I think I was able to get a "you'd compete"/"you might
compete" evaluation out of the coach (based on the workout and/or my
highschool career) before I went from from the visit.  Even for relatively
"non-competitive" schools, the fact that you might be on one of their
athletic teams might help you get in...

[Penn cut their gymnastics team (reduced to club) immediately following my
graduation :-(]



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 15:52:24 +0200
From:    ***@MERCUR.USAO.EDU
Subject: digests

my computer just ate my digest for today, and i was really really
intrested in the mukinea stuff. can anyone forward their digest to me? or
the stuff consering these messages? i've tried a database search on this
list server and it says this list has generated only 3 messages in the
past 48 hours
oh please someone help me


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 16:55:57 -0400
From:    ***@AOL.COM
Subject: FLEETCENTER Men's Olympic Trials

For Sale:

2 Tickets - Men's Compulsories Thu June 27, 1996 7:00 PM $30 each.
2 Tickets - Men's Compulsories Sat June 29, 1996 4:00 PM $45 each.

The tickets are for Section/Box Loge1 Row 12 Seat 18 and 19.

Please write if interested.



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 16:08:29 -0500
Subject: question re: Olympic Trials

Hey all,

Quick question. . .can spectators bring cameras or camcorders into the
Fleetcenter during the Olympic Trials?  Just wondering if they don't allow
it because of the flash, although I'm sure there'll be a million
photographers/journalists/media etc.

Thanks in advance.



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 15:41:26 UTC-0700
From:    ***@CS.UBC.CA
Subject: Re: TLC program and Jaime Hill (was TV and GYMN: general)

    Joy Anne asked about the title of the TLC program with Lavinia
Milisovici (?sp).  The title of the show is Peak Performance.  This
is a regular program with many episodes.  The episode with Lavinia has
been shown at least twice in the last few weeks (on May 18th in my area
and also during the Peak Performance marathon just last week).

    Jill asked about the whereabouts of Jaime Hill since 1993 Canadian
Nationals.  Jaime was on the 1994 Canadian Commonwealth games team.  She
finished 9th in the all-around and contributed to the silver medal won by the
team.  She was 6th in the bars final.  Since then, she has competed in the
1995 and 1996 nationals.  She was 5th in the AA in 1995 and I saw her name
on the recent 1996 results but don't remember her placing.  She did not qualify
for the 1996 Olympics (we don't get to send a full team).  I believe that
I've seen her in some televised meets in the last few years as well, but I'm
not sure about that.

    I don't know anything about the current whereabouts of the other people
Jill mentioned.


P.S.  I brief re-intro.  I'm one of the original members of Gymn.  I did
gymnastics for a year when I was about 10 and the only thing I learned was
a cartwheel on the beam so I didn't continue with the club the next year.
I was in my school gymnastics club in grades 7 and 8.  I'm contemplating taking
an adult gymnastics class, but it's too expensive for my current budget so for
now I'm just a spectator.  I attended the 1994 Commonwealth Games and the 1995
Canadian Artistic Nationals.  I hope to attend the 1996 world tumbling and
trampolining championships in August.


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 19:44:36 -0400
Subject: Marinescu profile

At the risk of starting another fight (this time between Alexandra fans and
Boginskaya fans), I'm posting an article that was in the Russian newspaper
Sovetsky Sport for May 23. Some things to keep in mind: the Romanian quotes
were translated into Russian and now into English, so there's plenty of room
for "distortion." I was as faithful to the Russian as I could be, but I have NO
idea how faithful the Russians were to the Romanian. The quotes do tend to
sound a bit arrogant at times, but I think (and got the impression the Russian
correspondent felt the same way) that Alexandra is just a self-confident young
girl who speaks her mind. And for Moceanu fans, take note of whom Alexandra
considers her main rivals in Atlanta. :)


     Fifteen-year-old Romanian gymnast Alexandra Marinescu cannot be accused of
a lack of modesty: When the young girl is asked who will be the favorite at the
women's gymnastics competition at the Olympics, she replies, "I will."
     The gray-eyed blonde is 145 cm tall, but she really could conquer many
heights at the Games in Atlanta.
     After the qualifying rounds at the 1996 World Championships in San Juan,
Puerto Rico, she made the finals on beam and finished second, trailing the
winner - Dina Kochetkova of Russia - by only 0.075 points. So there is a basis
for her statement. And Alexandra's coach, Octavian Belu, thinks it is
completely possible that his pupil will be able to win the AA at the Olympics.
     "She is the most talented of all the girls who have ever appeared in our
country," he says. "She reminds me very much of our former World Champion
Aurelia Dobre. She isn't as quick or as strong, but she wins people over with
her elegance and nice appearance."
     Alexandra achieved her first international victory at the 1994 Junior
European Championships, where she won both the AA and beam. At her first senior
World Championships in 1995 in Japan, she finished in ninth place in the AA,
yet the Romanian Federation hadn't even wanted to send her to the competition.
     "I can feel that I have a lot of talent," Marinescu says. "I would like to
be more elegant than the majority of the other athletes, and I work hard to be
more confident."
     Although some people will assess such statements as arrogance, she is not
afraid to express her opinion about her rivals, for example, Belarusian star
Svetlana Boginskaya, who at age 23 will be competing in her third Olympics in
     "I think that it would be better for her to retire," Marinescu says
without any doubts, and laughs. "It's hardly likely that she'll win even one
medal at the Games."
     The Romanian thinks a little more highly of China's Mo Huilan, now the
former World Champion on beam. Alexandra adores her older teammates Gina Gogean
and Lavinia Milosovici, the 1992 Olympic Champion on floor.
     "For me, Milo is an excellent gymnast. I would like to be more like her in
everyday life as well," the young girl says. "And from the standpoint of
technique, I would like to be more like Gina."
     Belu, who works as Marinescu's coach at the National Training Center in
Bucharest [sic], stated that his pupil could very well become the Olympic
Champion. But there are quite a few problems that need to be overcome for this.
     "Marinescu is sure of herself," the coach says, "although not enough. But
she is at the very beginning of her career, so she has quite a bit of time."
     Marinescu lives at the center and trains seven hours a day, five times a
week. She spends another three hours a day in school.
     Alexandra confesses that she is not homesick. "After all, I'm just a kid
and, to be honest, I simply don't know what to do there. I begin to get bored
right away," the gymnast laughs.
     Although many consider Marinescu one of the favorites for the Atlanta
Games, she herself is preparing for very tough competition from China's Mo,
Ukraine's Lilia Podkopayeva, Russia's Svetlana Khorkina and American Dominique
     The Romanians hope to win the team competition at the Olympics as well.
     As far as Marinescu's chances are concerned, Belu promises that his pupil
will look stronger in July. "We are preparing something special for Atlanta,"
he sums up. "But I can't tell you what it is. It's a secret."

(By Aleksandr Seregin)

     I'd just like to make one comment before a "war" starts. I don't think
it's necessarily arrogant for Alexandra to say she considers herself a favorite
for the Olympics. I believe that any gymnast who wants to contend for the gold
HAS to believe in themselves and truly believe he/she is capable of winning. If
you go into the competition thinking you have no chance, well, you probably
won't. I wouldn't be surprised if all the gymnasts she mentioned as her
greatest competition also think of themselves as favorites and leading
contenders. Who's to know what they'd say if asked directly... But I know
Aurelia Dobre gave the same answer before the 1988 Olympics (that she was the
favorite, along with Silivas).
     I DO wonder if Alexandra's wanting to take back what she said about
Boginskaya. I have a hunch this interview was conducted BEFORE Svetlana
finished 2nd AA at Europeans. But, on the other hand, few expected Bogy to do
so well, and 23 has to seem absolutely ANCIENT to a 15-year-old. I chalk it up
to Alexandra's youth and lack of experience in giving "diplomatic" interviews.



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 20:19:51 -0400
From:    ***@YORKU.CA
Subject: Canadian "where are they now" answers

        First of all, Jaime Hill was 11th all around, not 5th as someone
mentioned, at 1995 Canadian Nationals.  She left the Mississauga Gym Club
in fall of last year and has since been training at Winstonettes.  I
assume she is dealing with some sort of injury, as she did not
participate in our provincial or national championships this year.
        Darren Bersuk, who was IMO one of our most promising gymnasts
this cycle, did compete at Elite Canada this year (don't recall his
placing, but it was lower than expected).  I hadn't seen his name in
results since 1995 Elite Canada, where he was disappointed I"m sure not
to have made the Pan Am team.  He did compete AA at 1994 Worlds in
Brisbaine however.
        Sarah Rainey (not Cain - this is an American - as was mentioned
by the original question poser), retired in the summer of 1994 I believe,
shortly after returning to the Bluewater club (she had been with
Mississauaga for the past year).  She was *so* promising early on, having
competed in 1991 worlds, and was in third after 7 routines at the Olympic
trials in 1992 before injuring herself.
        I haven't seen Laura Chow in competition since fall of 1994, when
she made the Ontario team for the Canada Games (she ended up not
competing).  SHe was scheduled to compete at the National Stream Cup this
year as I understand, but didn't.  I assume she has retired, probably due
to injury.   I hope this helps.  THis information is accurate to my


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 16:12:41 -0700
From:    ***@QNET.COM
Subject: Old-Timers Meet

I just received a flier from World Stars Gymnastics in Camarillo,Ca =
about a Old-Timers meet on July 28. The first age group is 17 and goes =
up from there. Gymnastics definitely needs more meets like these to keep =
us "Old Timers" in shape. Their phone number, if you can make it, is =
(805) 338-5732. I will post more information on AV Twisters Web Page in =
our next update.


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 22:42:59 -0400
From:    ***@AOL.COM
Subject: Article on Chinese Women Gymnasts -- Mo and Meng

I've come across an article that is less than a week old about the Chinese
women gymnasts. It mentions, in particular Megn Fei and Mo Huilan. It is
pretty short, but it talks about how hard the conditions are for their
training and their lifestyles and coaches. It is from the Chicago Tribune. If
you're interested in my e-mailing you the article, please e-mail me at

LeeAnn  :)


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 23:17:04 -0400
Subject: Re: Marinescu profile

For fear of starting up the war again, I will limit my comments.
I think that Marinescu is very elegant and talented, and could possibly
win the all around.  I think she has a great chance with beam.
I just think she was plain rude about bogi.  Just the fact that she is
competing is amazing.  And I thought the true spirit of the gamess was
not to win medals, but to compete to the best of your ability.


Date:    Tue, 4 Jun 1996 09:54:11 -0500
From:    ***@INFOCOM.KIEV.UA
Subject: <No subject given>

>I turned on NBC a few minutes before the start of the Sonics game today
(Sunday afternoon) and caught the >end of a show called "Olympic Century". I
don't really know exactly what the show/series was, but they >said that in
the next broadcast they were going to feature some "greats" of the Olympic
Games including >Carl Lewis and Nadia (among others).

They actually showed that program here in Ukraine last night, dubbed of
course into Ukrainian. The channel that showed it is associated with the
international version of NBC.
Well, anyway it was interesting to see some of the skills that Nadia did
back then, as I had never really seen anything (except for a dismount or two
, before they flashed a 10 or a 1.0).
They did not mention her tens at all in this program, but focused on how she
was able to still compete at the 1980 olympics, despite her size, (her fall
off bars), and her tiny competitors.

They showed alot of (exerts of) tumbling passes (from random gymnasts), and
the most difficult was a double pike, and no one did it very well (of the
ones they showed) (IMHO). All of them did long pulled whipped entries, some
with legs way apart, into the double pikes. It is amazing how technique and
different training methods have improved that skill (among others, I am sure
). In ten years, we will probably be looking at Pod's double front, and
saying the same thing.

By the way, what will a double front, and a double twisting front be worth
in the next code? Are they being downgraded with the other front tumbling?



Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 21:39:33 +0000
From:    ***@ALOHA.NET
Subject: RSG European all around results-HELP!!!

Sorry to be so antsy folks but HELP!!!  Whats the latest on the RSG
Europeans?  I am dying to know the all around results.

Also did Maria Petrova make her comeback yet?


Date:    Mon, 3 Jun 1996 21:47:25 +0000
From:    ***@ALOHA.NET
Subject: USA RSG Nationals

Thank to the GYMNER's who posted results on the USA RSG Champs in

Here's some questions on attendance and the venue:

1.  Presumably the purpose of holding the champs in Athens was to
test the venue prior to the Olympics--any impressions of the venue.
I have a ticket to Olympic finals on August 4 but its one of the "el-cheapo"
ones so Im thinking its a nosebleed seat.  Anyone know if I'll be
able to get a decent recording of the event-I'm bringing a Sony
camcorder with 24x zoom.

2.  How was the attendance during the US RSG Champs?  OK stupid
question-so sue me-I'm a sucker for punishment.

3.  Anyone else agree that the US RSG Olympic trials is a complete
waste of time?


End of GYMN-L Digest - 3 Jun 1996 to 4 Jun 1996 - Special issue